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UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

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Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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> You keep saying killed, but there is a difference between letting people die and killing them. There's also a difference between letting people die for whom you have no responsibility, and actively taking on the responsibility to prevent deaths in exchange for profit, and then letting the people whose lives you're responsible for die. If you don't want to be held responsible when you let people die, don't take on t…

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Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a lot of people might believe their life or the life of a loved one was ruined or endangered by a health insurance CEO and such a person might feel justified in such an attack. When you think of the awful stress that CEOs put on people like https://www.reddit.com/r/SEARS/comments/18uwjvg/have_you_int... and think it's a wonder this doesn't happen more often but then I found out that Lampert had been kidnapped…

CEO pay is an outlier partly for their vision/talent, but primarily because they individually take the hit whenever a subordinate, no matter how far down the chain, fucks up publicly.

Sometimes it seems the other way with failing up. But yeah, a CEO sometimes has to take a lot of shit. See

https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/2024/12/2/intel-ceo-pat-ge...

Personally I do not care how much they get paid as much as I care how miserable they can make my life as a customer/vendor/employee.

Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#363
post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adding the ProPublica article which talks about United Healthcare specifically denying claims for terminal diseases for greater profits. https://www.propublica.org/article/unitedhealth-healthcare-i... edit: We do not know the shooters motivations, nor do I presume to know. But wanted to add a link for context to the above comment to show context for the statement.

I'm really surprised that we don't see violent action like this from terminal patients who have nothing to lose.

People who are so sick often can't do very much, it's truly evil to scam people in that position. Maybe relatives though.

Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CEO pay is an outlier partly for their vision/talent, but primarily because they individually take the hit whenever a subordinate, no matter how far down the chain, fucks up publicly.

Sometimes it seems the other way with failing up. But yeah, a CEO sometimes has to take a lot of shit. See https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/2024/12/2/intel-ceo-pat-ge... Personally I do not care how much they get paid as much as I care how miserable they can make my life as a customer/vendor/employee.

Err, unless he's tapping you to be his next-in-line, a CEO's impact on your happiness is vanishingly small relative to your customer service agent's, your sales rep's, or your immediate boss's.

Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will believe this if you show me the stats. You can use homicide rates, since they're hard to fake or badly under-report, and since many of the other stats crime stats also look pretty good for NYC and I expect you'll dismiss them as extremely incorrect—and it's not unreasonable to worry that they might be , so, you can just use the homicide rates. Maybe one "scary" big city is managing to do hide far-worse homicid…

maybe crimes besides homicides affect people as well? Like, I dunno, burglary, say.

Homicides are useful because if you use anything else the "nuh uh, it's impossible that (for example) NYC is safer than lots of other places" contingent will just point out (correctly!) that there are massive problems with crime stat collection and so the ones in the statistically-not-that-bad big cities must be faked [EDIT: or, at least, very inaccurate for other reasons] and the ones in the statistically-worse smaller cities and towns are simply not, or are less, faked (this part doesn't necessarily follow, but they're not wrong that it might be true)

Homicides are harder to hide, and are far less likely to go unreported, than other crimes.

The other useful route is victimization surveys. They introduce other issues, but the trade-off is well worth it for evading stats-juking or underreporting. Not a cure-all depending on the topic[1] but pretty good. I believe you'll also find NYC and some other perceived-by-many as especially-risky cities fall off the higher part of top-crime-city lists with this metric applied, when we lower the bar of what we're calling a "city" to include small and mid-sized ones.

Here's a fun one (check the study linked near the top if you want the source—the article's kinda ass, but the charts are handy) that attempts to use per-capita cost of crime to sort of normalize for overall severity of crime ("is double the overall crime rate really worse if 100% of those are pickpocketing and 100% of the 'lower'-crime city crimes are murder?", to illustrate the problem by exaggerated example) and does include smaller cities (broken out from the 300ish ones the study classifies as "large"):

https://thehill.com/homenews/nexstar_media_wire/4366668-thes...

(Some large cities are very dangerous and have crime problems! This source confirms that and I do not deny it! The goofy part is that, if you live in certain places and around certain sorts of people, they'll get super-worried about you when travel to ones that simply aren't that bad, and these same folks would never think to worry if you tell them you're visiting, say, Saginaw, MI, or Pine Bluff, AR, but, apparently, they should worry—hell, this whole illustrative exercise probably plays out in Saginaw regularly, I guarantee there are people there who tell their families "hey, cool news, I'm going to NYC for a week" and many of their family members get really worried about their safety)

[1] Picking up on sexual assaults with victimization surveys can be especially tricky. There are two main factors at play, one of which is simply that people are a less likely to report a sexual assault even in an anonymous poll than they are other crimes, and the other is that you'll get super-different results if you ask people whether they've been the victim of a sexual assault or rape, versus asking them whether they've experienced something that, as described, definitely legally qualifies as a sexual assault or rape—that is, a lot more people have factually experienced something that qualifies as SA or rape, than regard themselves as having been victims of those crimes, so... which thing are you trying to capture? Incidence rate of behavior that qualifies, or rate at which people regard themselves as being victims of that behavior? You need a different approach for each.

Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but there's a lot of speculation that it was a wronged customer. It could have been someone he works with. It could have been someone from his personal life. People who are not Healthcare CEO's also are murdered, there are lots of possible motives. We don't even know that the killer got the right person.

> We don't even know that the killer got the right person. The rest I agree with but this part we know, right? CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are not randomly gunned down... It 100% could have been anyone that committed this crime but they 100% got the right person...

> CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are not randomly gunned down...

Why not? I don't think random chance really cares about a person's occupation, it's just more unlikely because there are fewer of them.

Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#367
post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really surprised that we don't see violent action like this from terminal patients who have nothing to lose.

People who are so sick often can't do very much, it's truly evil to scam people in that position. Maybe relatives though.

But enough people are given a terminal diagnosis from relatively minor symptoms that will lead to their death in 6 months.

I think it's a really good open question as to why more unhinged Americans do school shootings than healthcare insurance executive shootings.

I'd love to read a sociology paper on it.

Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#368
post #340

It will always be a challenge to allocate limited healthcare resources. It's an unsettled question why the US accepts such an expensive means (private health insurance) of doing so.

It isn't like US public system, medicare, is great. I still end up buying my folks supplemental. This narrative of pubic vs private misses most of the nuance.

Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#369
post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not a gun dude, but I read that it is common when using "subsonic rounds" for quieter shots.

All of this seems to indicate this was a hired professional and not someone merely angry at their health insurance benefits.

'hired professionals' are always FBI agents. This guy didn't even do a test firing.

Re: UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson fatally shot in Manhattan

#370

What a dystopian world we live in where oligarchs controlling anti-trust companies deny medical coverage [0]. Am I surprised this happened... [0] https://www.propublica.org/article/unitedhealth-healthcare-i...

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My insurance denied me a MRI and physical therapy because having 2 working arms was a luxury. Had to pay out of pocket to be able to lift my arm above my head. Private insurance can go shove it.
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