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Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

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Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#361

Post by mynameisvlad »

nwienert wrote: post #346
mynameisvlad wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please show me exactly where I said otherwise. Read the comment thread you just replied to and tell me how any of what you just said is relevant to me correcting the sentence "Bing isn't dominating anything haha."

You said they are dominating "AI search" but that's wrong in many ways: - Google's entire search engine has had many layers of "AI" powering it for years. - Bing hasn't even released this supposed AI search engine to the public. Your other example was Tesla and the two examples couldn't be more different. Your statement would be like someone saying Tesla was "dominating" electric cars before they ever even sold a sin…

Just because Google uses AI for things like ranking does not put them in the same category as a search engine with AI integrated. I hope you realize that. There's a clear differentiator at play with Bard and New Bing, and that's the space people are talking about.

The market exists. Products have been announced. Some are clearly more popular than others. I don't know why you care so much that Google beats Bing, but it's plainly obvious both from people's and Google's own reactions that Bing is currently considered the winner in the space.

Will it last? Maybe. Maybe not. The very thread you are replying to is that first movers ultimately fail. But it's plainly clear Bing has captured the first mover advantage in the space, whether you like it or not.

Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#363

Post by ur-whale »

nus07 wrote: post #307
ignoramous wrote: post #270

When Sundar doesn't react fast enough: Google's gone. They no longer have the ship-fast mentality of an upstart. Perfect is the enemy of the good. The ethics lords have taken over Google Brain. Google needs a war-time CEO. When Sundar reacts fast enough: Google's gone. The product was rushed. It is no where close to perfect. Could it be Google's been bluffing about its AI. What a knee-jerk reaction. Google needs a wa…

Sundar faces intense spotlight because his background is McKinsey and Product Management . In core engineering and tech circles that’s the ultimate enemy and sell out. IMO Sundar hasn’t demonstrated the type of tech leadership like Satya or Zuck has. I am no fan of Zuck but he has a product he wants to pursue ( Metaverse) and is sticking to his guns to make it happen . Sundar just comes across as a pleasant McKinsey…

> There is no underlying tech vision or guts.

Spot on.

Sundar was in fact chosen for his totally bland, milquetoast leadership style, because Google was getting to a size, level of influence, and power that was starting to make governments queasy.

Choosing as useless, bland, uninteresting, non-threatening NO-OP of a CEO was perceived to be the best move to preserve the enormous amount of goodwill the company had in the market, even if their actual cultural stance had shifted 180 degrees from the the "don't be evil" days.

Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#364

Post by pphysch »

edgyquant wrote: post #181
muzz wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As should be your reaction to any new product or service, since that is how innovation works. Things are introduced to the marketplace, and most will fail.

No it isn’t. Most established companies don’t spin up and then down products at this rate otherwise Google wouldn’t be singled out for it. You’re doing damage control.

Most companies don't even try to innovate, they just hire MBAs to optimize their existing revenue sources.

Product failures are simply evidence of innovation.

The implication that Google, or Microsoft, is thoughtlessly or intentionally putting out failures is absurd.

Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#365

Post by scarface74 »

p_j_w wrote: post #359
scarface74 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bet you also think it takes effort to write the same boilerplate resignation letter/good bye letter. I’ve used the same two since 2012 across 5 jobs.

There's a big difference: no one gives a shit about how authentic a resignation letter is. A thank you note, especially to a friend? Thoughtfulness and authenticity matter there. A lot.

And yet the greeting card industry with generic messages is $4.7 billion.

https://www.ibisworld.com/industry-statistics/market-size/gr...

Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#366

Post by nylonstrung »

jjfoooo10 wrote: post #347
brandall10 wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It would mean that Google takes it seriously but also has the tech on a shelf in a usable form" Even if unusable, they have the network effects and brand... just get something out there to play with that will make some sort of impression, however flawed, that can quickly be iterated on. It can be ancillary to the current experience. Bing suffers from being so historically unpopular that from a branding perspective i…

Why should Google risk their brand reputation in this way? The majority of their users probably have never heard of ChatGPT. They just know Google as the thing that gives them factual information. Google have something to lose by directing their enormous user base to a buggy ChatGPT clone. Bing isn't unpopular, it's just a non-entity. They don't have any brand value to harm. > that can quickly be iterated on. It's pr…

Bing has ~8% market share and has been consistently stealing share from Google.

It's not the same scale but it has many millions of DAUs and is definitely not a "non-entity"

Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#367

Post by dahdum »

brandall10 wrote: post #335
vineyardmike wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google didn’t act fast enough over the last year but acted too fast over the last month . If Google was able to launch anything Bard related that someone could use -even if flawed- I think most people would call it a win. It would mean that Google takes it seriously but also has the tech on a shelf in a usable form . Google was understandably not worried about search until ChatGPT. Once the first whiff of search-repl…

"It would mean that Google takes it seriously but also has the tech on a shelf in a usable form" Even if unusable, they have the network effects and brand... just get something out there to play with that will make some sort of impression, however flawed, that can quickly be iterated on. It can be ancillary to the current experience. Bing suffers from being so historically unpopular that from a branding perspective i…

> Bing suffers from being so historically unpopular that from a branding perspective it's synonymous with failure.

AI integration is exactly the type of feature that could upend that. Google is the lackadaisical incumbent, too afraid of short term ad revenue decline to innovate. They've mastered shoving more ads onto the SERP pages and playing aggravating skip button games on Youtube.

They are no less corporate and staid as MS at this point, so if they fall behind I'd have no qualms in dropping them.

Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#368

Post by thereddaikon »

npalli wrote: post #9

Here's the weird thing though, as discussed yesterday [1], the Microsoft demo was totally broken as well. In the end, everyone is looking for a big platform shift (next MOBILE!!!) and hype getting ahead of reality. When we look back in 3 months we will wonder why we thought LLM/GPT type queries will replace search in all forms. https://dkb.blog/p/bing-ai-cant-be-trusted

Microsoft's demo wasn't perfect but everyone worth listening to has been saying ChatGPT is fallible this whole time. It was well within expectations.

Google however came in with a different expectation. I remember something about one of their execs disparaging OpenAI over inaccuracies before. If you are going to sling mud, you had better make sure you don't have the same problem. Or it makes you look like a fool.

Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#369

Post by ChickenNugger »

kweingar wrote: post #47

(Disclaimer: Google employee, I don’t work on Bard, views my own, etc.) I don’t think either Bing Chat or Bard is ready to be released widely. You need a certain mindset to be able to wring value out of them, and most normal users will not think this way. That being said, it’s probably fine to release these tools to enthusiastic early adopters who understand how to use them.

The conclusion (gross oversimplification) I came to yesterday is that these ML chatbots are basically just sophisticated madlibs. It's really misleading to even describe them as AI as they're not intelligences, but just rehashing things previously written by other humans (and I guess now other ML bots). They're not going to spit out anything completely new. That requires intelligence.

Re: Google employees criticize CEO for “dumpster fire” response to ChatGPT

#370

Post by brandall10 »

flakeoil wrote: post #344
brandall10 wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It would mean that Google takes it seriously but also has the tech on a shelf in a usable form" Even if unusable, they have the network effects and brand... just get something out there to play with that will make some sort of impression, however flawed, that can quickly be iterated on. It can be ancillary to the current experience. Bing suffers from being so historically unpopular that from a branding perspective i…

But if Google releases something that's bad or drags down the search experience then they have a lot to lose. If Bing releases something that's bad, then nothing is lost.

As I said, it can be ancillary to the current experience.
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