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Removal of Heroku free product plans

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Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#361
post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I relate to this. > We appreciate Heroku’s legacy as a learning platform. Many students have their first experience with deploying an application into the wild on Heroku. I'm one of those students. It's good that they will open up something free for students but I suspect it'll never be the same as just signing up and git push heroku master.

Render has pretty good free tier benefits, but no git push render master

Render does have auto deploys from GitHub/Lab so just `git push` is how people use us. Are you using a different Git host?

Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#362
post #326

This is a sad day. Pricing changes are always hard, and having been through some of the earlier pricing changes at Heroku you can't make everyone happy. But, so many developers deployed their first app on Heroku and was a staple for so many bootcamps. Without it I'm confident we'd have less developers in the world. It is still one of the gold standards for developer experience. Years after its heyday companies and to…

I just bought villainku.com. Will forward to heroku.com when the DNS is done. You die the heroku, or live long enough to become the villainku.

Ah yes, because a company that decides to stop giving away its time and resources for free is now a "villain". Right.

Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#363
post #71
post #3

> Starting October 26, 2022, we will begin deleting inactive accounts and associated storage for accounts that have been inactive for over a year. Starting November 28, 2022, we plan to stop offering free product plans and plan to start shutting down free dynos and data services. We will be sending out a series of email communications to affected users. Sad to see this, but not surprised after the Salesforce purchase…

I've found https://dokku.com to be a great (self-hosted) alternative to heroku. For hobby and small company size a cheap root server will do great. I've been running one at Hetzner for ~5EUR/month for more than a year now and had a very smooth experience.

There is also https://caprover.com, which seems to be more advanced and supports compose and docker swarm.

Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#364

This is a sad day. Pricing changes are always hard, and having been through some of the earlier pricing changes at Heroku you can't make everyone happy. But, so many developers deployed their first app on Heroku and was a staple for so many bootcamps. Without it I'm confident we'd have less developers in the world. It is still one of the gold standards for developer experience. Years after its heyday companies and to…

> But, so many developers deployed their first app on Heroku and was a staple for so many bootcamps. Without it I'm confident we'd have less developers in the world.

Given that many (most?) bootcamps are for-profit, it stands to reason that they should be able to pay for a basic level of Heroku services that their students can use, no?

> Gonna pour one out tonight for Heroku.

You're acting like they're dead, but that seems quite a bit premature.

Let's remember that the purpose of a free tier isn't just to give free stuff away. It's a marketing expense. The hope is that you get people to use the platform without the huge amount of friction involved in pulling out a credit card, and hope that they not only stay, but require more services that push them out of the free tier. You also hope that these free users will tell their friends and colleagues, who might also become paid users.

I'd guess that many bootcamp users would just use Heroku for their class projects, and after the bootcamp was over, never use it again. Their projects would just sit there, deployed on Heroku, active, without being used. Sure, some would end up using Heroku at whatever job they end up at; but, critically, most of them will be going into an org where it's already in use, so the free tier would not have acted as a customer acquisition tool in that case. And sure, some much fewer number would continue using Heroku in a capacity where they wouldn't otherwise do so. And finally, sure, some even much fewer number would both continue to use it, and start paying for it.

I'm sure Heroku's new-customer funnel will suffer somewhat without a free tier. But presumably they believe it's better for them not to have all that fraud and garbage on their platform. And they've been around long enough that they don't really need to work on increasing mindshare all that much.

Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you understand how much fraud and abuse is in the hosting world.

I've never said there wasn't any. Just that if you value a free tier (which you should if you want to attract developers) you find a way to deal with the fraud (or eat the cost). The fact that Salesforce either couldn't figure out (or didn't care to) the fraud and didn't want to pay for it spells bad news for the future of Heroku.

Again I don't think you understand the amount of resources that goes into anti-fraud teams in the hosting world. I used to work at a big hosting company and we had a team of 50+ people working around the clock to stop fraud ontop of tens of thousands of hours in engineering time to automate as much as possible. It STILL wasn't enough. I can only imagine how much worse it is when you have a free product offering.

Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#366
I imagine this will be an unpopular opinion here due to the VPS provider, but if anyone is looking for a completely free way to spin up hobby apps, Dokku running on Oracle's very generous free tier is tough to beat. 24GB RAM and 4 VCPUs (granted, ARM Ampere processor) is enough to spin up a ton of small hobby apps and even good enough to run a few production apps at decent scale.

Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#367
post #88

This is a sad day. Pricing changes are always hard, and having been through some of the earlier pricing changes at Heroku you can't make everyone happy. But, so many developers deployed their first app on Heroku and was a staple for so many bootcamps. Without it I'm confident we'd have less developers in the world. It is still one of the gold standards for developer experience. Years after its heyday companies and to…

In our case, this would mean increasing our Heroku bill by 400% (we run a few paid apps and >40 free dynos with super low monthly activity) Does anyone have a recommendation how to re-create the Heroku experience on AWS or Azure?

I'm completely biased as I work on the nanos/ops unikernel toolchain but unikernels offer a very PaaS like feel as the app and server become one. You simply build your image (ops image create) and then deploy it (ops instance create) - two commands. Takes tens of seconds to have something running on AWS. If you are on a AWS/GCP free tier it costs nothing but even a a g1-small costs only ~$20/month and a f1-micro goes for ~ $5/month which can go a long way. We've had a go unikernel be on the front page of HN on a f1-micro and it barely registered any resources being used.

Besides the perf/security boost you aren't locked in to anything. You could take the same application and deploy it to multiple clouds simultaneously if you wanted to as it is making use of cloud primitives - nothing cloud-specific unlike some of the various serverless offerings.

Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the situation may be perhaps different to the one you describe. Heroku seems to have been pretty clear about the abuse and fraud that led to this move. It's a shame all round. I don't have an MBA and am not a beancounter, but have some experience on the economics of the free tier. It's not pretty.

If you take them at face value that's the reason, personally they've lost nearly all my trust so I'm wary of accepting that as the reason. Also fraud and abuse are not unique to Heroku, every hosting provider with a free tier has to worry about that. This is a case of throwing the baby out with the bathwater as well as showing they don't really care about new developers coming to their platform. In this thread and th…

I agree with most of what you say. The question I have is why would anyone care about new developers coming to their platform unless they had a plan, one day, to monetize those folks?

Re: Removal of Heroku free product plans

#370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At $49/m we could get a decent bare metal server for each of our apps. From where/with what kind of specs? $49/m sounds still well within VPS territory unless I'm wrong.

Hetzner has dedicated server auctions for ~35 USD/mo. All are in EU datacenters though. https://www.hetzner.com/sb

What's a US data center equivalent? OVH? What's their lowest price for a dedicated server monthly?
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