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How to set junior employees up for success in remote

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Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#361

Post by astura »

lkrubner wrote: post #125

(quoting book) Amanda Nock, a tech leader and devops expert who posts frequently to Twitter, offered this in response when I posted on Twitter about how to hire good people remotely, “When I hire remotely, I ask about their online friends.” Nock doesn’t need the details of anyone’s online friendships, but she needs to know that the person has developed a serious friendship online; otherwise that person probably doesn…

Wow, this is truly awful.

If you want to test someone's asynchronous remote communication skills then communicate with them remotely and asynchronously. How much trolling they do on Reddit in their free time is completely irrelevant.

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#362

Post by lamroger »

davewritescode wrote: post #335

This is just fairly obvious and I've probably posted something about it before in HN. It's the same reason in-person school works much better than remote, students and junior employees need fast feedback while still giving them the room to work independently. Real world example, I gave a junior engineer a bug that should take a day to research and 3 lines of code to fix. If I'm sitting a few desks away and I hear the…

You could also preface with "I think this should take a few lines of code to fix - I'll let you look into it but if you're feeling stuck by 3pm, feel free to Slack me with what you got so far and we can pair"

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#363

Post by selfhoster11 »

dj_mc_merlin wrote: post #325
selfhoster11 wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a health hazard, but it is a bottleneck in a very real sense if you want to keep more than one thing open (whether for reading, writing, running commands, or a combination thereof). It's not just a matter of preference.

I use a tiled window manager + emacs buffers, my 15.6" screen almost always has 2 applications open and 4 when I feel the need. Never had a problem running commands or reading documentation all at the same time.

OK, it's great that this works for you. Some people can't readily adjust to tiling window management, and barely anyone will switch to emacs (for reasons that would take a couple of paragraphs to summarise adequately).

Even I use a tiling terminal application, but that still leaves me needing another display for the web browser and work chat, for instance.

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#364

Post by astura »

Agamus wrote: post #238
zeroonetwothree wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your experience as a child learning from a laptop?

On that topic, no, I am referring to observing my own children learning from a laptop. I could not have been more skeptical of this approach at first. I was wrong - the approach has worked well so far. EDIT: I definitely should have mentioned that my children are learning from a laptop WITH very close guidance from my wife who is raising them full-time and with intense dedication!

>my children are learning from a laptop WITH very close guidance from my wife who is raising them full-time and with intense dedication!

In other words, they are not at all just learning from a laptop.

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#365

Post by astura »

MattGaiser wrote: post #259
mfer wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> IMHO it's turnover that's the problem. In software I've seen this to be a huge problem. In other disciplines my observations are that it's not as bad. The turnover issues is something that could use a lot more exploration. Nothing is going to change until it impacts those who are distant from the front line engineers. The managers of the engineers know about the problems. The executives over them are distant from t…

> The turnover issues is something that could use a lot more exploration. It is about pay. If you switched jobs in the past year, you got a massive raise. If you stuck around, you got peanuts, if anything.

I mean... I stuck around and got a 20% raise, fwiw.

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#366

Post by KronisLV »

aftergibson wrote: post #188
lkrubner wrote: post #125

(quoting book) Amanda Nock, a tech leader and devops expert who posts frequently to Twitter, offered this in response when I posted on Twitter about how to hire good people remotely, “When I hire remotely, I ask about their online friends.” Nock doesn’t need the details of anyone’s online friendships, but she needs to know that the person has developed a serious friendship online; otherwise that person probably doesn…

What nonsense, so are we expected to ask how many friends you have IRL to gauge someone’s ability at synchronous communication? I can communicate remotely in a business setting (and have done) for many years. I don’t make friends online because it’s a personal preference. It’s the same as “show me your GitHub profile” but maybe after 8 hours on a computer asynchronously communicating and coding. I don’t want to code…

> What nonsense, so are we expected to ask how many friends you have IRL to gauge someone’s ability at synchronous communication?

Couldn't one draw parallels with the concept of networking here? As in, certain people might get a job because of being extroverted, seizing the opportunities that present themselves, as well as seeking those out on their own volition?

All qualities that might be preferred in certain roles, almost like a sort of self-selection.

Not saying that it's something that should always be selected for, but I suspect that it might be a bit like coding tests: vaguely useful despite the fact that they're not exactly the best method.

> It’s the same as “show me your GitHub profile” but maybe after 8 hours on a computer asynchronously communicating and coding. I don’t want to code or make friends on discord.

What if they want you to be the kind of person who does? I mean, you might want to avoid companies that expect you to live and breathe code (which might coincide with being available 24/7), but one can definitely imagine that such qualities would also be factors that companies would look for.

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#367

Post by dj_mc_merlin »

selfhoster11 wrote: post #363
dj_mc_merlin wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use a tiled window manager + emacs buffers, my 15.6" screen almost always has 2 applications open and 4 when I feel the need. Never had a problem running commands or reading documentation all at the same time.

OK, it's great that this works for you. Some people can't readily adjust to tiling window management, and barely anyone will switch to emacs (for reasons that would take a couple of paragraphs to summarise adequately). Even I use a tiling terminal application, but that still leaves me needing another display for the web browser and work chat, for instance.

> Some people can't readily adjust to tiling window management, and barely anyone will switch to emacs

Then those are preferences, not need. I agree a second monitor should be provided if asked, but in no way is it a requirement. I'm not alone in my preferences either. I learned to code in Turbo C where the line length was _puny_ compared to even this comment box here. I was probably more productive back then.

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#368

Post by Consultant32452 »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #359
kevinmchugh wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give me advice on how to provide oversight in a way that's not demoralizing, infuriating, patronizing? I found working with juniors _fun_ and rewarding in person. Remote i have hated it and don't think I've been good at it

One thing that has worked for me in the past is to do some regularly scheduled pair programming. When I'm driving I narrate my thought process and encourage questions. They get to see things and when I make a little typo and they can catch it, not only does it save me a few seconds but it makes them feel GREAT that they helped the senior dev. Making this highly interactive and the senior driving FIRST makes it still…

Oh, another thing I find helpful is to make it clear up front what I'm doing and why. I don't just narrate what I'm literally doing in the programming, I narrate why we're doing this at the meta level and what the expectations are. I also make it clear that as they get more comfortable there will be less oversight.

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#369

Post by nemetroid »

_dain_ wrote: post #18
ZetaZero wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO, an expensive keyboard/mouse/monitor isn't necessary for a junior to succeed. Plenty of coders learned on much worse.

That's penny wise, pound foolish thinking. A good keyboard and mouse and monitor for your developers (who directly earn you revenue) is not going to break the bank. But the lack of them will reduce productivity and morale, possibly even causing (on the margin) some talented people to leave. RSI and posture problems are no joke! In other industries you need immense capital investment in equipment for workers to be pro…

The fact that good equipment makes economical sense doesn't refute the argument that good equipment is not a requirement for a junior to succeed.

Re: How to set junior employees up for success in remote

#370

Post by openg4525 »

lkrubner wrote: post #125

(quoting book) Amanda Nock, a tech leader and devops expert who posts frequently to Twitter, offered this in response when I posted on Twitter about how to hire good people remotely, “When I hire remotely, I ask about their online friends.” Nock doesn’t need the details of anyone’s online friendships, but she needs to know that the person has developed a serious friendship online; otherwise that person probably doesn…

Lol if she supports using people's social media accounts in the hiring process... Does she support using arrest records with the FBI for domestic terrorism? Because Amanda Nock has one... Idk, perhaps we should all be careful who we take advice from.
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