Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

scitechdaily.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

361–370 of 400 posts

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#361

Post by yodsanklai »

mikepurvis wrote: post #177
yodsanklai wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I tell everyone to never take benzos for any reasons You can't generalise your experience. Everybody is different and that's the doctor's job to assess whether the benefits outweigh the cost, considering the patient and their problems. Personally, I've been taking benzos very occasionally for 20 years (never more than a few days at a time) and they helped me overcome difficult times. Never had the slightest addicti…

This whole discussion is making me feel better than ever for choosing cannabis edibles (legal in Canada) to address stress-induced insomnia and other sleep issues for which the root cause was not something I was in a position to immediately address. I take it a few times a week as needed, small doses (2-5mg) and I feel that I am in control of it and could go off any time.

I use benzo to reduce anxiety, not for sleeping. In some situations, I'm so anxious that I'm not able to work properly (e.g. giving an important talk, dealing with stressful situation at work). Benzo magically removes the anxiety and let me function properly.

This isn't my experience with cannabis: it does relieve anxiety but it also makes me unable to get anything done, which defeats the purpose.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#362

Post by jnovek »

tsol wrote: post #339
coconut08 wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

long term constant exposure to opioids will literally begin cause the pain they purport to solve. If you give a perfectly healthy person with no pain at all opioids for long enough they will be indistinguishable from a person who has an actual chronic pain issue. people should only ever take opioids VERY TEMPORARILY to get through surgeries or other such things. Opioids are not for long term pain management. Same thi…

Are you being treated with chronic pain by any pain killers? I've heard this before, but it's not exactly as you put it. Chronic opioid use leads to sensitization to pain. This doesn't mean it is equivalent to the pain being treated. In my experiencing minor sensitization to pain in exchange for treating debilitating, disabling, and depression-inducing pain is an amazing trade. I'd do it again without a second though…

The main thing I’ve learned over the last few years is that people without chronic pain have absolutely no understanding or frame of reference for what people with chronic pain experience.

I would happily trade 10 to 20 years off of my life to live the remaining ones pain-free and functional.

Edit: One of the most frustrating things I experience are doctors who don’t understand topics that guide “no tolerance” policies; for example, they are aware they hyperalgesia exists — much like the GP — but don’t really know what it is or what it’s like for the patient.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#363

Post by SemanticStrengh »

gavinray wrote: post #359
ineedasername wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After all of those, what did you settle on for managing anxiety long term? Was it the Etifoxine?

I keep Etifoxine on hand for acute panic attacks and take l-Theanine + Ashwagandha daily for general anxiety. The over-the-counter supplements don't do much but it's better than nothing.

do you think it is sustainable to take etifoxine daily or does it leads to addiction/tolerance?

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#364

Post by jnovek »

nordiazepam wrote: post #237
sva_ wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have friend who was at nursing school, and she'd get them prescribed for the few occasions where she had to do a presentation, as she would get extremely nervous. She never took them after. Maybe she could've addressed the issue differently, but it worked for her, and she never got hooked. But milage varies, and so on. She also told me that at the hospital, benzos are readily available and they kinda hand then out…

> I think they only work if you got anxiety or something Probably something to that. I didn't feel much at the prescribed dose. Being curious and foolish, I took 3x. Did feel that. Socially effusive. Good sleep. There was a physical aspect. A warm glow, muscles that felt relaxed rather than stiff. Like waking up in warm sun after a particularly good night's sleep. People without anxiety, who aren't literally and meta…

Were you receiving any other kind of therapy for your anxiety during this time?

I tend to see it a bit like “medication stabilizes; therapy heals”.

I tend to see the opioid epidemic (which is comparable to the current benzo problem) as a systemic failure. You were handed a loaded gun and no one taught you how to use it.

Our medical system is designed to be transactional, but the experience of a chronic condition is a narrative.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#365

Post by RGamma »

whimsicalism wrote: post #351
RGamma wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually the opposite. Pharma making people addicted: Opioid epidemic and all.

it has gone very much the other way in recent years, it is not easy to be prescribed opioids in the US nowadays.

Oh I wasn't updated on that development. Good to hear!

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#366

Post by jnovek »

shepardrtc wrote: post #29

I was prescribed benzos because of sleeping issues, but I was also taking phenibut at the same time. After about 3 weeks of using large doses of the benzos every night, I stopped taking them, but a year later I still feel pangs of withdrawal sometimes when I get stressed. It took me another 4 months to get off the phenibut and a month or so after that before my sleep returned to normal. There were months where I mayb…

“I once went three days without sleep.”

This is just a side note, but I’ve never heard of anything like this happening before with such a short course of benzos.

That doesn’t mean it’s not happening, and it doesn’t mean that it’s not the benzos, but because it’s an unusual outcome, have you considered looking into other possible causes?

You were taking the benzos for sleep, after all, could a different underlying cause have gotten worse or been exacerbated by the benzos?

To be clear, this isn’t to diminish or invalidate your experience, it’s genuine concern from another human.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#367

Post by SemanticStrengh »

whimsicalism wrote: post #351
RGamma wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually the opposite. Pharma making people addicted: Opioid epidemic and all.

it has gone very much the other way in recent years, it is not easy to be prescribed opioids in the US nowadays.

source/numbers of the number of prescriptions per year? https://www.hhs.gov/opioids/about-the-epidemic/index.html

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#368

Post by throwaway284534 »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #208
throwaway284534 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a exactly the kind of puritanical catch-22 that entrenches every corner ADHD treatment. “Oh, your justification for access to the high-inducing , party drug of amphetamine is that it’ll cure your lack of focus? Well, if these dangerously addictive drugs so effective, then surely you can handle 30 day prescriptions with no refills.” God forbid your prescription runs out on a weekend or holiday when your doctor…

If doctors are concerned about abuse, they can just prescribe lisdexamphetamine instead of dextroamphetamine. Abuse potential, addiction and the subjective high associated with these drugs are all related to the speed it enters the brain. Lisdexamphetamine gets slowly converted into dextroamphetamine once in the blood stream. Much safer drug in general, not sure why it's not as widely used as Adderall.

You’re absolutely right. I actually chose Vyvanse for that same reason, and yet the limits are still applied as if the drug is as abusable as Adderall.

Personally, I have no difficulty tapering doses on the weekends, even pouring out half the capsule’s powder. I once asked my doctor if they could prescribe sixty 20mg pills instead of thirty 40mg pills. Half doses when I’m taking the day off, right?

Wrong. Insurance only fills 30 pills per month and they have to be of the same potency. Ironically, if you asked your doctor to give you the 70mg pills, you could dump the excess powder for an emergency reserve and end up with far more medication!

The rules are totally made up and there’s no actual reason for limits other than the projection of “being tough on drug abuse.”

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#369

Post by gavinray »

SemanticStrengh wrote: post #363
gavinray wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep Etifoxine on hand for acute panic attacks and take l-Theanine + Ashwagandha daily for general anxiety. The over-the-counter supplements don't do much but it's better than nothing.

do you think it is sustainable to take etifoxine daily or does it leads to addiction/tolerance?

I can't give anecdotal evidence on daily use because I've not used it in that way, but between medical literature and my own experiences my guess would be that you could take it daily.

Dependence-causing anxiety medication generally had noticeable psychoactive effects. EG, Phenibut, benzos, etc.

I wasn't sure if it did anything at first because I can't notice any kind of headspace change. But sure enough, if I have anxiety and feel like I might get a panic attack, taking ~100mg makes the anxiety subside.

I've also had really good experiences with Buspirone, 10mg twice daily.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#370

Post by bradlys »

shepardrtc wrote: post #29

I was prescribed benzos because of sleeping issues, but I was also taking phenibut at the same time. After about 3 weeks of using large doses of the benzos every night, I stopped taking them, but a year later I still feel pangs of withdrawal sometimes when I get stressed. It took me another 4 months to get off the phenibut and a month or so after that before my sleep returned to normal. There were months where I mayb…

> Treat the cause, not the symptoms.

By all means comrade, supply UBI, universal healthcare, and quality housing for free.

The reason I was stressed in college is because I didn’t have those things and I needed to work exceptionally hard in a cutthroat stack ranked program to stay afloat. Once I was making $100k+ (I was living in SV) and had a financial cushion instead of barely scraping by - I didn’t have as severe of sleeping issues. Same with getting a partner. It was nice to share the bed with someone instead of being alone for 26 years.

Doctors prescribe stuff because that shit isn’t possible to fix by them or nearly anyone else on an individual level. It requires systematic changes to our entire economy (and dating economy for the relationship part).

Post reply on HN