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YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

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Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#361

Post by lern_too_spel »

cryptonector wrote: post #302
virgildotcodes wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your argument seems to boil down to: “bad things have happened before, so bad things aren’t bad”. 1. In a close election, contesting it or demanding a recount is fine and sane. Step aside once the results of that process are in. Trying to discredit the entire system with a mountain of bullshit and overthrow an election when it is overwhelmingly clear that it did not go in your favor is an incredibly dangerous road fo…

I'm saying we don't do prior restraints on speech in the U.S. Law enforcement can take care of the rest.

And YouTube is saying that it is not obligated to carry content that convinces stupid people to do dangerous things. Doing so causes chaos, which ultimately reduces advertising spend and hurts profits.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#362

Post by d0gsg0w00f »

ehsankia wrote: post #359
another_story wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit different considering the west has alternatives which are not blocked, whereas China doesn't. You can even spin up your own sources and serve whatever you want,a right not afforded the average Chinese citizen.

Every single day on HN, people mix up giving someone a platform to censoring someone. Social platforms are megaphones. Up until a decade ago, it was impossible for nearly everyone to reach out a large audience, especially worldwide. Nowadays, anyone can make a video accessible by billions of people with a single click. If people banned from that is "censorship", then by that definition the whole world was censored 2…

But is taking away the megaphone the same as silencing them? When everyone has a megaphone, those who don't are not heard.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#363

Post by robjan »

jrobn wrote: post #351

Death and calamity is going to be the theme of the next 100 years and beyond. Climate change, mass displacement, cheap & effective propaganda, ignorance, resource contention, soil degradation, nuclear proliferation. We've only had nuclear weapons for 70 years. We used them to blow each other up on day 1. The odds are not in our favor that nuclear warfare will be contained.

Death and calamity has been the theme of the whole of history. We're still generally in a much better situation than 100 years ago, even better than 200 and so on.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#364

Post by throwawaythekey »

incompatible wrote: post #325
atlantas wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Confession: I only just realized over the past few years. I had always thought that authoritarians were a right phenomenon.

It depends how you see "left" and "right". I see the left as promoting equality, and generally freedom, and the right justifying or increasing inequality. An authoritarian system by definition gives far more power to some people than others, which is an idea of the right. However, systems of government in practice are generally not strictly left or right, and you get the likes of the Soviet Union which gave some degr…

Left to me feels more pro fairness but anti freedom. Either way though in most conceptualizations libertarianism/authoritarianism is usually separated from left/right

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Political_Compass_stand...

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#365

Post by ekianjo »

ehsankia wrote: post #359
another_story wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit different considering the west has alternatives which are not blocked, whereas China doesn't. You can even spin up your own sources and serve whatever you want,a right not afforded the average Chinese citizen.

Every single day on HN, people mix up giving someone a platform to censoring someone. Social platforms are megaphones. Up until a decade ago, it was impossible for nearly everyone to reach out a large audience, especially worldwide. Nowadays, anyone can make a video accessible by billions of people with a single click. If people banned from that is "censorship", then by that definition the whole world was censored 2…

> then by that definition the whole world was censored 2 decades ago.

Nope, you are misunderstanding something here. Removing what was considered "given" is what becomes perceived as censorship.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#366

Post by kasey_junk »

bko wrote: post #356
DoctorOW wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give an example? What's a view that's been eliminated?

Heres an example: Bari Weiss was fired for commissioning an op-ed by a US Senator Tom Cotton calling for the national guard to be called in to break up riots. Note that she did not write the essay, but merely commissioned it. They sometimes have op-eds from varying voices. NY Times apologized and said "This review made clear that a rushed editorial process led to the publication of an Op-Ed that did not meet our stan…

Are you arguing that Bari Weiss, who was brought in specifically as part of an editorial decision to appeal to alternate viewpoints, is an example of alternate viewpoints being censored?

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#367

Post by rootusrootus »

monkpit wrote: post #148
bfung wrote: post #67

Seems like the underlying problem is that YouTube is 1 generic platform that contains news, entertainment, random home videos, etc. Perhaps the right answer is to “divide” it up and set requirements for each category of video, similar to how “YouTube kids” is a thing now. News and podcasts would go under its own section and have some level of sanity checks while home videos can be as random as they want to be.

As a parent I must say, that’s an extremely generous characterization of YouTube Kids.

Whenever I see YT Kids I get the nagging feeling that the content may actually be more harmful to kids than regular YT.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#369

Post by pyuser583 »

Fezzik wrote: post #176
pyuser583 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 2000 Presidential election was attacked as illegitimate. I was watching the latter seasons of X-Files and Fox Mulder made a comment on 2000 elections, something like “that sounds about as reliable as our elections.” Plenty of folks, Howard Dean comes to mind, said they were straight up illegitimate. Even now many on the left insist it was a tie or something. This thing of “if you don’t win the elections, question…

The Bush v Gore fiasco is nothing like what is going on now: in 2000, in Florida, after all votes were tallied, the vote totals were so close a recount was legally mandated . During the recount a large number of ballots (actual, tangible evidence) were noted to have unclear undervotes and overvotes on them and were simply not counted. To compare this to the utterly baseless claims that lack even a scintilla of eviden…

Even if the discarded ballots Gore fought to save had been counted, Bush would have won.

It was very close. Close enough to reveal the messiness that extremely close elections can create.

But not enough to change the outcome.

Bush won. He probably won by double digits in Florida. But he still won.

As late as 2008, Howard Dean was falsely claiming SCOTUS had “snatched” the election from the Dems, which was demonstrably untrue at this point.

https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/05/howard-d...

Read that article. Nowhere do you see the “this is a lie” disclaimers. Yes, Trump is spreading disinformation, as Howard Dean did (and probably still does.)

Here’s another good example: by the end of the Democratic Primary in 2020, Biden had more than enough votes for the nomination. He had won, plain and simple.

But he and Sanders kept campaigning, because they knew an active campaign would turn out Democratic votes in downstream elections.

The press went along with this facade. At no point did they “declare a winner” even though Biden had effectively won.

They allowed the charade of a campaign to go on, allowing Democrats a heavy advantage in elections like the Wisconsin State Supreme Court.

Again, the election was already over, and a winner should have been declared. But it wasn’t.

The press is very selective. And study after study after shows journalists are almost exclusively Democrats.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#370

Post by DoctorOW »

BuyMyBitcoins wrote: post #318
DoctorOW wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's fair. Instructions on drinking bleach might cause others to be harmed. This is different because nobody has ever come to harm because of this. I'd imagine if people believed this, there would have been some kind of violence on say, January 6th the day of the insurrection-- sorry, inauguration. Please let me know if you know how to fix this unfortunate typo.

> ” Please let me know if you know how to fix this unfortunate typo.” You can click the edit button. But you’re probably trying to make a snarky point. If we are going to say that censorship is justified because you want to prevent violence or insurrections, we open the floodgates to some seriously bad things. Here’s a scenario: Claiming that people are being systematically discriminated against could lead to violenc…

> You can click the edit button.

Don't think so.

> If we are going to say that censorship is justified because you want to prevent violence

Nope. Just agreeing with my parent comment that there is a significant difference between harm-causing misinformation and this very good election business.

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