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Just Be Rich

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Re: Just Be Rich

#361

Post by zimpenfish »

WalterBright wrote: post #281
d_silin wrote: post #7

A lot of people who are just as smart and motived as Elon Musk or Steve Jobs will never be able to start their own companies and get rich. Because they have family obligations that take priority. Because they live outside high-income countries. Because they have no access to support network, so when they fail, they fall all the way to bottom. Because they may have made a crippling mistake in their pasts that now prev…

It's never been easier to start a company in the US. All you need is a computer. You can create a product on it and reach a worldwide audience, all for free. As for Jobs, he started Apple for a few hundred bucks. It's a pretty low bar.

> All you need is a computer.

Plus free time. Plus motivation and energy which is probably in short supply when you've already done 8 hours in a supermarket / your second job / a full day of childcare / etc.

> a few hundred bucks. It's a pretty low bar.

For a lot of people in the US, a few hundred bucks is the difference between eating that month and going without. Or being able to pay the rent and not be evicted. Or being able to afford transport to/from their job.

Re: Just Be Rich

#362

Post by random314 »

herbst wrote: post #323
heavyset_go wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What first world country can people emigrate to without a sponsor, a degree or specialization?

Or money. Money works too. None i guess, but gladly many people have the possibility to get some kind of degree these days. Just because you come from a poor country does not mean you have no means of learning a job.

I think you haven't been to a poor country. Case in point India is more than 20% illiterate.

Re: Just Be Rich

#363

Post by bambax »

nindalf wrote: post #151

OP mentions PG’s article arguing against a wealth tax. That article is short, simple and to the point - Modelling a Wealth Tax ( http://www.paulgraham.com/wtax.html ). It is so compelling, but also misleading and wrong. Its not easy to spot the sleights of hand he uses. I wrote more about it here - Modelling a Wealth Tax Correctly ( https://blog.nindalf.com/posts/wealth-tax/ ). And yet, I think the simplicity of PG’s…

PG's essays have an agenda, which is to defend the rich and the incumbents, disguised as revolutionaries.

Because they are young? But they are the same as the robber barons of old.

Re: Just Be Rich

#364

Post by ookdatnog »

imtringued wrote: post #266
camhart wrote: post #247

Income inequality is growing, yes. But are the wealthy somehow responsible for it? Is their "getting richer" directly responsible for it? There seems to be a growing consensus on the left that they are. I have yet to see a convincing argument to show this though. Someone who builds a company worth 100m didn't have to steal money from me (or anyone else) to do it. If they did steal, then that's what needs fixed. Preve…

>It's at best a band-aid attempting to treat a symptom caused from underlying issues. We need to treat those underlying issues--not the symptom. The underlying problem is that the economy is breaking basic macroeconomic equations, namely that savings must be invested. A wealth tax would force such an outcome. This is unpopular for republicans. Government investment would force such an outcome. It's still unpopular fo…

Then the textbook is wrong though. Most sciences operate by postulating models and then verifying experimentally whether their models hold up in practice. Economics is the only science I know of that seems to have almost a disdain for experimental verification, combined with the comically arrogant attitude that if reality doesn't conform to their models, then surely reality must be wrong.

Re: Just Be Rich

#365

Post by thundergolfer »

SequoiaHope wrote: post #185

“You would think, after having been on the side of labor in its fight with capital for almost two centuries, that the far left would be happy that labor has finally prevailed.” This is listed as a quote from the PG essay. It seems to represent a fundamental misunderstanding of what “labor” means here. When the left fights for “labor” it is for all laborers to get a fair shake. PG seems to be talking about the fact th…

I bet you Peter Thiel understands Marxism. Comfortably the most honest tech billionaire I’ve read.

Re: Just Be Rich

#366

Post by 0wis »

agumonkey wrote: post #269
d_silin wrote: post #7

A lot of people who are just as smart and motived as Elon Musk or Steve Jobs will never be able to start their own companies and get rich. Because they have family obligations that take priority. Because they live outside high-income countries. Because they have no access to support network, so when they fail, they fall all the way to bottom. Because they may have made a crippling mistake in their pasts that now prev…

Veritasium had a video about success vs luck and survivor bias. There's a bit of that here too. That said, I'd love to have a graph or model (or book even) to describe the tipping point at which things become increasingly better and easier. I observed that in the crypto bubble. Once you lifted off (fortune by accident maybe) you can comfortably ride the game from the back seat and pick what kind of new wealth you're…

This ! So much easier to hussle if you have a clear goal in mind. The threshold to « wealth » should be clearer. FIRE « levels » seems a good approximation but more detailed studies would be great.

Re: Just Be Rich

#367

Post by TheButlerian »

camhart wrote: post #325
bobmaxup wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would equality be better than the bare necessities?

Assuming by "equality" you mean everyone is given the same amount of money regardless of what they do or achieve, then no it's not better than bare necessities. A degree of struggle is good for us. It pushes us to become more than we could without it. Don't take this to mean I want everyone in poverty--that's not what I'm saying. But being motivated to work towards a financial goal is a good thing. I do not believe a…

Have you considered crippling yourself - blinding, cutting off a leg, etc. This way even going to the toilet would be a huge struggle and you will get amazing sense of accomplishment all the time.

Re: Just Be Rich

#368

Post by chii »

imtringued wrote: post #276
camhart wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There isn't a finite amount of "wealth" in the world. You can go out and make wealth every single day. The rich obtaining more of it doesn't mean there's less left over for you and I. People need to be able to cover their needs. Food, housing, healthcare, and I'd be open to arguments in favor of education. But I don't see income inequality as bad necessarily. I see massive amounts of people unable to cover those need…

>There isn't a finite amount of "wealth" in the world. You can go out and make wealth every single day. The rich obtaining more of it doesn't mean there's less left over for you and I. Non invested savings are zero sum. This is just macro economics. If one person has a savings surplus, the other person has a savings deficit (unemployment). Buying existing housing isn't an investment. Building new housing is. Buying a…

> Buying existing housing isn't an investment....Buying an existing company isn't an investment.

yes it is - because the person you're buying it from now can invest the proceeds of that sale (to something else).

Buying shares off the sharemarket is investing - not because you're directly giving the company your money, but because your buying is the end of a chain of investment that directly leads to the IPO at the other end. Same with housing.

Your way of seeing only direct investment as "true" investment is too shallow, and lacks the actual nuance of how the financial markets operate. If you sell your shares to somebody else after an IPO, the IPO might not ever have happened, or that the raising of money costs more (to account for the risk of having to hold the bag till the company profits). By strata-ing the risk out to different people, the financial market allows all levels of risk to be bought, by all manner of different people.

The direct "investment only" method is as primitive as bartering for goods/services.

Re: Just Be Rich

#369

Post by saint_abroad »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #330
d_silin wrote: post #7

A lot of people who are just as smart and motived as Elon Musk or Steve Jobs will never be able to start their own companies and get rich. Because they have family obligations that take priority. Because they live outside high-income countries. Because they have no access to support network, so when they fail, they fall all the way to bottom. Because they may have made a crippling mistake in their pasts that now prev…

Success is 100% luck.

> Success is 100% luck.

If that were the case, then there would be no disparity.*

* That is, unless luck is a function of circumstance. Which is kind of the point of the OP.

Re: Just Be Rich

#370

Post by cryptica »

> But it's also obvious to anyone outside the SV bubble that it's still only accessible to a small minority of people. Most people don't have the safety net or mental bandwidth to even consider entrepreneurship.

That is barely touching the surface of the problem. Having the bandwidth to become an entrepreneur is the least of anyone's problems.

I know many people who have gone to extraordinary lengths (like working non-stop 24/7 nights and weekends in addition to their day job) starting a startup, building a great product but it just doesn't grow.

There are a lot of monopolistic forces which prevent a startup from growing when you're not in the 'Silicon Valley Club'. Receiving VC funding is not even about money, the most important part about raising funding is the social aspect; that it makes you part of the club. The product you're working on doesn't matter at all. It's all about being in the club...

To join the club is all about your appearance and personality and not about skills.

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