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The Deno Company

deno.com

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Re: The Deno Company

#361

Post by tnolet »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #329
srmarm wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like https://deno.com/deploy will be a managed service - the implication seems to be that the default option will be to use their CDN to run code with an option to DIY if you prefer.

How does this business model survive Amazon AWS making a blog post, "Here's a template to run your deno code on Lambda!"? They'll never beat AWS on costs in the long term. They can burn VC cash to stay afloat and try I guess.

There are many, many companies competing with AWS on products that strictly speaking AWS also has.

I mean Zoom has no right to exist because you can use Chime?

There is always room for better UX, better support, different approach etc.

Re: The Deno Company

#362

Post by forty »

sneak wrote: post #327
forty wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. And I guess the package still needs to be compiled to JS before deploying to production? To avoid shipping a full TS compiler on a production server which would be a crazy thing to do.

I don't think that would be that crazy, especially if it's in the stdlib.

It seems like a huge amount of code and potential vulns to bring in production for no good reasons.

Re: The Deno Company

#363

Post by carlosf »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #329
srmarm wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like https://deno.com/deploy will be a managed service - the implication seems to be that the default option will be to use their CDN to run code with an option to DIY if you prefer.

How does this business model survive Amazon AWS making a blog post, "Here's a template to run your deno code on Lambda!"? They'll never beat AWS on costs in the long term. They can burn VC cash to stay afloat and try I guess.

Lambda has a ton of caveats and limitations... but it seems their platform is full of limits as well:

https://deno.com/deploy/docs/pricing-and-limits

AWS sucks hairy balls at providing things that are simple for developers to use, so that could be their competitive advantage, but I'm just guessing here.

Re: The Deno Company

#364

Post by whimsicalism »

tnolet wrote: post #361
qbasic_forever wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does this business model survive Amazon AWS making a blog post, "Here's a template to run your deno code on Lambda!"? They'll never beat AWS on costs in the long term. They can burn VC cash to stay afloat and try I guess.

There are many, many companies competing with AWS on products that strictly speaking AWS also has. I mean Zoom has no right to exist because you can use Chime? There is always room for better UX, better support, different approach etc.

I find the idea that AWS will just eat the competition always a little silly as well. I've used AWS managed offerings that were far inferior to the alternatives.

Re: The Deno Company

#365

Post by xixixao »

shusson wrote: post #348
xixixao wrote: post #323

> The Deno company hopes to enable the millions of web programmers out there to maximally leverage their craft in other domains. I know this might be hard to see, but Rust is actually in the same domain. It is also, among other things, enabling product/frontend/web engineers to build backend/native/browser-less applications. I'd bet Rust will be more successful here, especially given its amazing ability to change its…

> It is also, among other things, enabling product/frontend/web engineers to build backend/native/browser-less applications. Care to explain? I can imagine web programmers being productive in deno in a few minutes vs however long it takes to learn an entire new language, not to mention a language that requires memory management.

See the Rust Foundation announcement: https://foundation.rust-lang.org/posts/2021-02-08-hello-worl...

> "A language empowering everyone, but especially folks who thought that systems programming wasn’t for them.”

Re: The Deno Company

#366

Post by webmaven »

resonantjacket5 wrote: post #317
davnicwil wrote: post #73

What I find most exciting here is: > Our infrastructure makes it possible to... create custom runtimes for different applications [like] Cloudflare Worker-style Serverless Functions Fascinated to see what happens here. The serverless / edge compute paradigm fits Javascript hand-in-glove philosophically, but until now it's always felt quite clunky to me. When I've tried it out, I've always been left thinking "but this…

Not against url-based imports but I don't quite understand why is "no implied dependency on stateful disk in the runtime itself." a big deal?

> Not against url-based imports but I don't quite understand why is "no implied dependency on stateful disk in the runtime itself." a big deal?

I think that lets you deploy to things like edge devices that don't have a hard drive, and even more ephemeral environments.

Re: The Deno Company

#367

Post by jppope »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #329
srmarm wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like https://deno.com/deploy will be a managed service - the implication seems to be that the default option will be to use their CDN to run code with an option to DIY if you prefer.

How does this business model survive Amazon AWS making a blog post, "Here's a template to run your deno code on Lambda!"? They'll never beat AWS on costs in the long term. They can burn VC cash to stay afloat and try I guess.

Lambda uses containers vs. cloudflare workers use v8 isolates. v8 Isolates are much much faster and more secure for serverless functions.

Deno seems to be targeting cloudflare as a competitor for their service... But it's probable that AWS will release a cloudflare worker competitor themselves if deno continues with the MIT license.

Re: The Deno Company

#368

Post by tin7in »

elisee wrote: post #15

Happy to see Deno get some financial backing! I've been building my new multiplayer games website [1] with Deno over the last 4 months and apart from some minor growing pains, it's been a joy to use. The lack of unnecessary package management, and the TypeScript-by-default approach makes Web dev much nicer. We're also using TypeScript on the client-side, relying on VSCode for error reporting. We use sucrase to strip…

Hey, the Discord invite link is not active anymore.

Re: The Deno Company

#369

Post by tomxor »

notJim wrote: post #262
tomxor wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This probably either sounds nuts or over opinionated but I don't think the NPM ecosystem is as valuable as people think it is... stuff is deprecated continuously anyway - when you find a way to move away from 10k dependencies (because your shortsighted previous self decided to depend on a single package without looking closer), it's a damn relief. I hate how needlessly complicated the NPM ecosystem is, I would actual…

> Most of the packages on NPM are complete garbage And don't do anything. I'm amazed by how often I read the source for a package I'm interested in, only to find it's about 10 or 20 lines of code. The convenience of adding a package means that if you're not sure how to do something, you can easily just add a package to do it rather than figuring out how to do it yourself. A lot of the time, you can just read the sour…

I'm not afraid to say I agree with you, i'm not sure why you are being down voted... This is one of the attributes that is part of my argument against NPM, packages which are at the extreme end of too small, delivering almost no value at the cost of a lot of risk.

This is also an opinionated subject, and as with most things in life there is a balance somewhere in between the two extremes. However the NPM packages you refer to (and yes I have seen the In response to the sibling comment on duplication: all I can say is that it cuts both ways, deduplication to the extreme also has downsides: when someone changes that code you don't control, it now affects a large number of dependencies that the author may not care about. But even ignoring those issues and assuming you package-lock everything and never look back, extreme de-duplication in general can result in highly illegible code due to a lack of holistic view: whether it's achieved with thousands of tiny external packages or thousands of tiny 3 line functions in the same file - many have covered this topic in detail before, deduplication for deduplication sake never ends well, abstractions always have a cost.

Re: The Deno Company

#370

Post by elisee »

tin7in wrote: post #368
elisee wrote: post #15

Happy to see Deno get some financial backing! I've been building my new multiplayer games website [1] with Deno over the last 4 months and apart from some minor growing pains, it's been a joy to use. The lack of unnecessary package management, and the TypeScript-by-default approach makes Web dev much nicer. We're also using TypeScript on the client-side, relying on VSCode for error reporting. We use sucrase to strip…

Hey, the Discord invite link is not active anymore.

Which one? The home page one seems to work for me. Otherwise try: https://sparks.land/discord
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