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Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

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Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#361

Post by jeremyjh »

fluffything wrote: post #221
saluki wrote: post #115

I was a huge Google Fan but this is becoming lunacy. I understood trading some data and privacy for great search results, maps and free quality email. But people willingly bringing always on listening devices in to their homes (beyond what smartphones are already capable of) I just can't comprehend it. Why would people voluntarily do this in exchange for being able to ask for weather, play a playlist, add a todo and…

> Why would people voluntarily do this in exchange for being able to ask for weather, play a playlist, add a todo and a few other parlor tricks. I don't really understand why the device needs to store my recording and send it over the internet. I would be willing to pay more for a device that guarantees that my recordings are deleted immediately.

Echo does this - only wake word phrases are sent to the internet - but it is not guaranteed by the hardware. Also your failed requests - where it recognized the wake word but not the request - are listened to by QA people. Those could easily be private conversations with an accidental wake word.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#362

Post by zaptheimpaler »

LudwigNagasena wrote: post #2

>"Gosh, I haven't thought about this before in quite this way," Osterloh said. "It's quite important for all these technologies to think about all users... we have to consider all stakeholders that might be in proximity." How much do they not care about privacy that a chief exec with an army of lawyers and advisors "haven't thought about this before"?

Its a baldfaced lie. In 2019, with all the concern about privacy in the world it is inconceivable that they haven't thought about it. The transition of tech power to the sociopath overlords is complete.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#363

Post by TeMPOraL »

glitcher wrote: post #252
saluki wrote: post #115

I was a huge Google Fan but this is becoming lunacy. I understood trading some data and privacy for great search results, maps and free quality email. But people willingly bringing always on listening devices in to their homes (beyond what smartphones are already capable of) I just can't comprehend it. Why would people voluntarily do this in exchange for being able to ask for weather, play a playlist, add a todo and…

I blame Star Trek. Simply speaking out loud to ask the computer anytime something was needed, it seemed like magical tech. We just didn't anticipate the companies and extra consequences that would come along with it. I would love to see a parody of Star Trek where all the tech is run by an advertising company exploiting all the crew members individually by capturing all their private data around the clock.

It works in Star Trek, because as 'api says, their society is sane. United Federation of Planets is an utopia, where people don't try to abuse and profit off each other.

For a proper Star Trek comparison, imagine how comfortable Federation citizens would be with using ambient computing technology created and sold by the Ferengi, who are also known to be performing surveillance for Romulans in exchange for money.

(For non-Trekkies here, Ferengi is a species of extremely greedy and exploitative capitalists; Romulans are what you'd get if you reified the Five Eyes into a species, and put them into state of cold war with the Federation.)

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#365

Post by seandougall »

marcosdumay wrote: post #359
oppositelock wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does having a Nest thermostat get you? I'm a tech dude, I build modern software, but I live in a dumb, old fashioned house. My programmable Honeywell thermostat, which has no internet connection, does a perfectly fine job of keeping my home the right temperature. My door locks use a key, and keys have great battery life, and my smoke detectors beep instead of speaking to me. What am I missing by not having inter…

Why does a thermostat integrate with cameras and microphones anyway? Do they have any internal one? Anyway, I do really want a smart home lock. Just changing the shape of the keys so that they would stop puncturing my pockets when I walk would be enough of a gain. I also want a programmable bedroom light that can slowly dim on at morning. I don't have those because the costs are much higher than the benefits. I'm sur…

> I also want a programmable bedroom light that can slowly dim on at morning.

FWIW, a lot of cheap CFL bulbs do this on their own. It's one of the reasons I hate CFLs for most uses, but I've come to appreciate that the light in my kids' room starts at about half (perceived) brightness and takes a minute or two to warm up.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#366

Post by bob1029 »

slouch wrote: post #301
NelsonMinar wrote: post #262

Don't forget all the TV panels in your house listening in on you too. Me, I don't plug any "smart" TV into the Internet. But a lot of folks do. I think the horse has left the barn on this kind of technology. What I hate most about it is that it's impossible for an ordinary person to understand exactly what all might be spying on them at any moment.

Sure, but TVs aren't always on like this Nest device.

This is not always true anymore. Many modern Samsung TVs (and I am sure some other popular brands) have a standby update option, which would imply it is actually "always on".

Ideally, it is only checking for the latest firmware version while you think it's off, but almost certainly it is doing other nefarious things you have zero visibility into.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#367

Post by TeMPOraL »

CobrastanJorji wrote: post #314
api wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it looks comfortable in the Star Trek universe because Star Trek portrays a society that is not run by mobsters, warlords, delusional ideologues, and sociopaths. We are still very much savages. Clinical psychopaths and delusional narcissists run our institutions and major decisions are made on the basis of fanatical superstitious ideologies and mindless herd behavior. In short I won't put an Internet connecte…

> Star Trek portrays a society that is not run by mobsters But also portrays societies run by and indeed composed entirely of mobsters (see "A Piece of the Action" TOS S2E17).

It does, but the protagonists are part of the utopian society; in that context, technology actually works to benefit people.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#368

Post by J5892 »

exclusiv wrote: post #344
oppositelock wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does having a Nest thermostat get you? I'm a tech dude, I build modern software, but I live in a dumb, old fashioned house. My programmable Honeywell thermostat, which has no internet connection, does a perfectly fine job of keeping my home the right temperature. My door locks use a key, and keys have great battery life, and my smoke detectors beep instead of speaking to me. What am I missing by not having inter…

A programmable keypad is nice. I have a Z-wave one which can notify my Smarthings hub which notifies me when it's locked or unlocked. The Nest thermostat allows me to control the heat remotely. These two things are great for rental properties. Guests often forget to lock the door, I have records of when guests or maintenance people are coming or going, I can adjust the heat to 55 when nobody is there which saves a lo…

I'm assuming that by rental property you mean AirBNB or some other short term rentals.

I would never be okay with my landlord controlling or monitoring my thermostat.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#369

Post by tareqak »

JCBarry wrote: post #338
oppositelock wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does having a Nest thermostat get you? I'm a tech dude, I build modern software, but I live in a dumb, old fashioned house. My programmable Honeywell thermostat, which has no internet connection, does a perfectly fine job of keeping my home the right temperature. My door locks use a key, and keys have great battery life, and my smoke detectors beep instead of speaking to me. What am I missing by not having inter…

It is probably worth mentioning that the Google Nest Thermostats are one of the only Nest devices without a microphone. Source: https://support.google.com/googlenest/answer/9330256?hl=en

Thank you for this information 'JCBarry. I was legitimately alarmed and confused. I searched for the word “thermostat” in the article, and I didn’t find it, but I could easily be out of date with respect to Google’s Nest and IoT branding.

Thanks again,

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#370

Post by DennisP »

cmsonger wrote: post #268
DennisP wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the voice interface is implemented locally then it's not a problem. Google already has it working on the Pixel. It has some limitations but it responds faster and works offline. https://techcrunch.com/2019/03/12/googles-new-voice-recognit...

> If the voice interface is implemented locally then it's not a problem. That's not really observable or enforceable by me though. A question I ask myself all the time before I say yes to some kind of "new data tracking" is: "How do I think company_x will behave in 10 years if their profitability is plummeting?" Because I think that paints the worst case for companies that so far have been good actors. I guess the TL…

It's also possible for any software to have a keylogger. We don't really worry about that, because if it unexpectedly sends data, someone is likely to notice and tell everyone.

Voice interfaces today work like keyloggers by design, and we're just trusting them not to abuse all the data they're getting. It'd be a lot better if we didn't have to.

(I'm on board with legal protections too, of course.)

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