Master Plan, Part Deux • Hacker News Board

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#361

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:22 AM UTC

vacri wrote: post #338

d_t_w wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"He wasn't voted in; the other party was voted out" He won the 2013 federal election as the leader of the Liberals, that's fairly conclusive. "The leadership here isn't dire" We disagree. "Besides, if you use 'dire' for something as beige as Turnbull, what have you got left for something like Erdogan's latest activities in Turkey?" Criminal? The question is whataboutery.

Ah, you're right. Rather than living in one of the most stable and wealthy societies on the planet, we're actually falling fast towards a Mad Max-style dystopia. I must remember to weld some more armour onto my car tonight... Just because we're not living in an impossible utopia doesn't mean the situation is dire. We haven't had great leadership since the Hawke/Keating years (over 20 years ago), yet still the country…

[deleted]

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#362

Post by wycx » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:29 AM UTC

maratd wrote: post #205

seanp2k2 wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electric cars cause pollution; they run on mostly coal or natural gas and have very toxic-to-mine, manufacture, and dispose-of batteries. They also emit just as much particulate emissions as normal cars: http://www.digitaltrends.com/cars/electric-car-particulate-m... The way to "save the planet" is to not drive. Driving a 5000# vehicle around thinking you're doing good for the environment is just the marketing genius…

> have very toxic-to-mine, manufacture, and dispose-of batteries. This is absolutely false. Lithium is not toxic to mine at all. It isn't even "mined". http://cleantechnica.com/2016/05/12/lithium-mining-vs-oil-sa... > Electric cars cause pollution They cause zero pollution when you have solar panels on your roof and the car is properly scrapped after you're done with it. > The way to "save the planet" is to not drive…

In addition to bainal brines, lithium is also produced by mining spodumene from pegmatites.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spodumene

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegmatite

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#363

Post by anjc » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:29 AM UTC

danhak wrote: post #89

Animats wrote: post #64

"A first principles physics analysis of automotive production suggests that somewhere between a 5 to 10 fold improvement is achievable by version 3 on a roughly 2 year iteration cycle. The first Model 3 factory machine should be thought of as version 0.5, with version 1.0 probably in 2018." What that really means: Tesla is going to lose a ton of money per car on the Model 3, or raise the price, until at least 2022. T…

Ford can have fewer employees per car because they're at full scale, they've outsourced nearly all their engineering and have outsourced their sales as well via an antiquated dealer model. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hf15nMnayXk

> have outsourced their sales as well via an antiquated dealer model.

That's not outsourcing, that's distribution. Every industry in the world has similar distribution channels. They still have a large sales department.

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#364

Post by moeamaya » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:30 AM UTC

maxander wrote: post #152

Elon Musk is like the cat who tried to jump from the sofa to the top of the bookcase, fell to the floor in a tangle of wildly gyrating limbs, and is now sitting there quietly licking its paw like it was intending to do that all along. Even with his brilliance he's fooling no one into thinking the SolarCity merger was actually in his plan- there are some synergies, sure, but they're easily outweighed by the added corp…

Slightly confusing and elaborate position based on https://www.tesla.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-plan-j.... Do you mind expanding?

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#365

Post by jacalata » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:30 AM UTC

sp527 wrote: post #244

Joof wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do. It just doesn't mean it's true or necessarily a requirement. Nor does it mean the car is better. A better locksmith takes less time to open a door.

Did you just utilize an analogy concerning destruction to make a point about production?

Do you think locksmiths destroy the locks they open?

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#366

Post by sp527 » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:32 AM UTC

jacalata wrote: post #365

sp527 wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you just utilize an analogy concerning destruction to make a point about production?

Do you think locksmiths destroy the locks they open?

No. That phrasing was more pithy. Not wholly inaccurate if you think in the abstract, however.

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#367

Post by jacalata » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:32 AM UTC

int_19h wrote: post #339

eyelidlessness wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suburbs destroy public life, create anxiety and a sense of atomization, and turn natural spaces into scar tissue. Even if you could perfect transportation technology, suburbs are the least optimal configuration for humans to live in the world.

Dense urban areas create anxiety for me, while suburbs give the nice quiet retreat with plenty of open space, and no random annoyances. I bet I'm not alone in this. Don't assume that your subjective personal experiences translate to everyone. Here's a question for you. If suburbs are "the least optimal configuration", then why did urban sprawl occur in the first place? Why did so many people leave the cities and soug…

Tragedy of the commons.

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#368

Post by greglindahl » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:34 AM UTC

oh_sigh wrote: post #324

bryanlarsen wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google may have a lot fewer miles, but they're much higher quality miles. The sensor suite on their car is much superior, so they're getting much better data. Even if the eventual Google car uses cheaper sensors, the data they get from the superior sensors helps a lot training the algorithms.

Does google collect high velocity data like tesla's? I heard that the google self driving car was limited to 25mph in the areas where they tested it, and so their data may only be reflective of that.

Google operates several kinds of cars -- I see the Lexus ones driving at highway speeds on 101 all the time.

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#369

Post by thruflo22 » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:36 AM UTC

Car roof or house roof?

Re: Master Plan, Part Deux

#370

Post by puranjay » Thu, Jul 21, 2016, 6:37 AM UTC

aerovistae wrote: post #240

ams6110 wrote: post #101

My points of skepticism: 1. Semis . A typical long haul semi gets well under 10MPG. In some cases not much more than half that. They are heavy and need a lot of energy to move. A Tesla Model S weighs 4650 lbs and has a range of a couple of hundred miles. A semi truck can weigh up to 80,000 lbs. That is a lot of weight to get rolling and a lot to pull up a grade. Semis spend a large part of their time driving at highw…

1. They'll be able to line the entire trailer with batteries. Elon's pretty good at physics and engineering: if he says this can be done better than existing gas-powered semis, you're not going to be able to prove him wrong with some back-of-the-envelope arithmetic, as if he hadn't considered this. Obviously he has and knows it will work. Tesla didn't get this far on vague conjecture. 2. Maybe so, but it will happen,…

Most criticisms of Tesla are so...amateur. They try to point out obvious issues which Musk and team must have thought out on day 1.

People still treat this company as if it is some stoner's living room project, not a multi-billion dollar organization that built the best electric car on the planet while its sister company built a reusable rocket