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Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

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Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#351

Post by swed420 »

XorNot wrote: post #147
swed420 wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What a childish, stupid opinion. Democrats lost to a gameshow host . Twice. They just had to be better than that, and they couldn't manage. Pathetic. They also created the conditions for his rise. Twice. The bar is so amazingly low, and yet you can't comprehend how they keep fumbling this. Maybe, just maybe, it's a good cop / bad cop arrangement where only capital interests win, and it's a race to the bottom for ev…

So you're capable of identifying that how people vote does matter, that the electorate actually did determine the outcome, you are not alleging that the election was actually rigged, but you think not voting in a first past the post electoral system - while expressing dissatisfaction with the outcome as decided by the voters - will achieve something?

You're ignoring the important fact that Dem primaries are rigged, or like last time, simply non-existent. Their agents of capital are preselected from the start.

Feel free to pretend you have a voice in the ballot box, but you don't in any significant way. You get to decide the color scheme and decide between decorum or crude, but it's the same pile of self-serving shit behind the scenes.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#352

Post by swed420 »

Arodex wrote: post #319
georgemcbay wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> An "independent" in America is a person who greatly desires everything Trump is doing but realizes that makes them a bad person and therefore refuses to admit it. There's some truth to what you're saying, particularly a few years ago... but a rapidly increasing number of "independents" in America are strongly left leaning but feel that the Democratic party has abandoned them. And they'll continue to vote Democrat,…

>but a rapidly increasing number of "independents" in America are strongly left leaning but feel that the Democratic party has abandoned them. Then they are listening to the Right. Biden did what he could to help unions and eliminate student debt. The truth is those "left" leaning want socialism, but only for them, and not brown people. Socialism but only for their in-group. (That's also what you see with recent immi…

> Biden did what he could to help unions and eliminate student debt.

LMAO, etc

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#353

Post by znpy »

autoexec wrote: post #8

Corruption in the US isn't new, but it's never been done as openly as it has been recently. I don't think it's a good thing. It shows that the government isn't concerned about what the public thinks, which suggests that they believe they no longer have to be. That's not a healthy sign for what's supposed to be a democracy.

It is concerned, but not in the way one would think.

From what i hear politicians like Gavin Newsom from California are passing bills to prevent independent journalists like Nick Shirley from exposing fraud and corruption.

That signals that they (government officials) are extremely concerned with what the public thinks, but mainly in the sense that they don’t want the public to have the information that would put them in a thought spot.

On the other hand, the fact that fraud and corruption is only reported by some early-twenty-something independent youtuber/journalist should really tell you a lot on the state of mass media in the USA (in the sense that the mass media are essentially colluding with politicians).

(Downvote me if you want, I don’t care)

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#354

Post by swed420 »

dabinat wrote: post #251
hakunin wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saying “US corruption isn’t new” is a truism. There are probably isolated incidents, and many unproven theories, but everyone is quick to agree with this statement because it’s a common feeling everyone has now for some reason. The reality of corruption is likely much smaller and more boring than people think. What we’re witnessing now is what should be called corruption. That corruption that everyone has been scream…

I guess it’s more accurate to say that corruption didn’t start with Trump (he wasn’t even involved in politics when Citizens United was happening, for example). The US has been marching in that direction for a while. The difference now is the openness and also the scale. If a president does one bad thing the press will dig into it, committees will investigate, etc. But what if the president does 20 bad things every s…

> The difference now is the openness and also the scale.

Yes, we just need to go back to the good ol' days of corruption with decorum

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#355

Post by znnajdla »

We are seeing the decline and fall of an empire in realtime, it's just the cycle of life, nothing lasts forever. It's one of the reasons why I decided to do my own thing and build my own small bootstrapped startup outside of the West, and am much happier than being a part of something much bigger which is clearly in decline.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#356

Post by dwoldrich »

I love the compartmentalization people can do when it comes to corruption. Willfully blind to "my team", the propaganda is so thick.

Life will get interesting when 89% of people learn about the regular corruption in elections and the rehypothication of stocks.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#357

Post by huhtenberg »

jakobnissen wrote: post #276
autoexec wrote: post #8

Corruption in the US isn't new, but it's never been done as openly as it has been recently. I don't think it's a good thing. It shows that the government isn't concerned about what the public thinks, which suggests that they believe they no longer have to be. That's not a healthy sign for what's supposed to be a democracy.

I don’t think that’s right. The US government cares a lot about what the public thinks about them. They propagandize actively on social media, the president puts his personal name onceverything, they are extremely persistent in their messaging to loyal reporters and so on. I think they have discovered that what the public thinks simply no longer tracks what they actually do: "I could stand in the middle of Fifth Aven…

> The US government cares a lot about what the public thinks about them

... only because the elections aren't completely rigged yet and they still need some votes to cling to the power.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#358

Post by ninkendo »

swed420 wrote: post #354
dabinat wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess it’s more accurate to say that corruption didn’t start with Trump (he wasn’t even involved in politics when Citizens United was happening, for example). The US has been marching in that direction for a while. The difference now is the openness and also the scale. If a president does one bad thing the press will dig into it, committees will investigate, etc. But what if the president does 20 bad things every s…

> The difference now is the openness and also the scale. Yes, we just need to go back to the good ol' days of corruption with decorum

No but we do need to go back to the good old days of having like 1/100th the scale of corruption we have now.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#359

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

atmavatar wrote: post #201
dimgl wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this whole "that half" and "this half" thing makes it significantly harder to hold people in the government accountable. I know plenty of conservative people who think the corruption in the government is out of control.

Do they act on their beliefs or merely parrot them? I ask because I've known people who were shocked at what took place 2021-01-06 but who proudly voted to re-elect Trump. Today isn't much different: talk to a conservative voter who complains about the tariffs, Iran war, etc. and ask them whether it would be enough for them to vote Democrat, and the answer is near universally no. Lots of people have performative outr…

Elections are won and lost by the people who don't vote so not voting for Trump still counts as a win.

Most politics is sold as tribal. "Our leader" and "Our team" are not the same thing. If "Our leader" is a disappointment, "Our team" can still be the good guys who need to do some house clearing, introduce some fresh blood, and all will be well again, etc.

Reality in the US is most politics is billionaire-funded. Trump didn't just happen, and he certainly didn't pull himself into the top job through his own efforts. He was groomed for decades before being crowned.

That's the level of corruption most of the population never sees. It's why the establishment is so scared of wildcard politicians and the DSA as a movement - both threaten to snip the strings of corporate funding.

As long as those strings are there, what happens in the media is kayfabe. The real decisions are made elsewhere, and the big tentpole events - 9/11 and its aftermath, the various Middle Eastern wars, financial crashes and bailouts - are the special menu the rich get to feed off, and the public never sees in advance, never mind votes on.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#360

Post by JohnHaugeland »

TylerE wrote: post #292
hakunin wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saying “US corruption isn’t new” is a truism. There are probably isolated incidents, and many unproven theories, but everyone is quick to agree with this statement because it’s a common feeling everyone has now for some reason. The reality of corruption is likely much smaller and more boring than people think. What we’re witnessing now is what should be called corruption. That corruption that everyone has been scream…

Counterpoints: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tammany_Hall https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teapot_Dome_scandal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanborn_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiskey_Ring https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Friday_(1869) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cr%C3%A9dit_Mobilier_scandal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_land_fraud_scandal and that's just the 19th century, nevermind the 20th.

wow, in 150 years we find a handful of things much smaller than what has happened in the last 2 years

the whisky ring is definitely relevant to a discussion of today’s problems

this isn’t a ridiculous padded list of whataboutism

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