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What happened to nerds?

mrmarket.lol

351–360 of 541 posts

Re: What happened to nerds?

#351

This happens in any industry where value/status are at a premium. Finance, Law, VC guys were good too in the beginning but when the value/status change happens it attracts certain kind of guys who are average in talent but excel in demonstrating value and social management of the value/status. Another change which has happened recently is that the economics of engagement farming have become common place wisdom as alr…

Academia is the most relevant, toxic example that I can think of. Be horrible to others on a short term contract (grad students, postdocs) and break them whilst extracting maximum value -- get more papers, more grants written -- more money -- success. Be nice, think about hard problems for a long period of time, only speak up when you have something positive to contribute -- be labelled an underperforming academic an…

Great little article. 12 years later, he is still right on every count. Who would have thought that Peter Higgs was a very clever, clear-thinking man

Re: What happened to nerds?

#352
post #240

It really changed when the game went from "Build the best product" to "Get the highest valuation" and the means of doing so were specifically NOT about building the best product. VC money was a factor, public exits were a factor, but even more generally, the idea became that you could become a billionaire without making anything at all. Just create enough FOMO among the monied and you win. This is not nerd stuff... i…

Yes - Psychopathy is a thing, last time I researched, in the CEO territory.

I assume it is selected for.

I assume it benefits those at the tippy-top of the western corporate structure.

They make more money, taking advantage of situations that squish other people, in my view more quickly than those with fewer pathologies. In my personal experience they seem to be tacitly accepted by boards & investors. I understand "maximizing profits" is the job.

Not a new thing.

- https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/08/the-science-behind-why-so-ma...

Re: What happened to nerds?

#353
the technology industry spent forty years accumulating a very specific kind of trust and mostly had boring motives, which made us appear trustworthy and largely benign

Are we on the same planet? Trust and motives? Is this some kind of secret that we’re not supposed to talk about? Tech, from its very beginnings, has been about libertarianism, subversion, counter culture, trying to be cooler than the people, wanting to wield power over them, misogyny, abusing free speech, racism, gatekeeping. The list keeps going of so many bad characteristics.

“core nerd values: a love of learning, curiosity, an obsessive interest in your domain, and an admirable humility”

Again what planet is this? Most nerds are some of the most self important condescending better than you social weirdos.

Ohhhh yes. Here it comes

“occasionally arrogant (not always, IMO. Sometimes you're just right.”

Ah yes applauding arrogance as correctness.

Phase One. Holy. The delusion here thinking that 1970-2007 was some golden CEO age. Do you live your life never understanding the incredible pain and exclusion and mistreatment that people experienced and continue to everyday? Is that by choice (willfully ignorant) or are you just this privileged that you thought the world was fantastic?

Here’s the fact: These CEOs, SVPs, Directors, Managers, Engineers didn’t just magically become shitty people in recent years. They’ve always been terrible people right down to the no-social-skills neckbeard who manages IT. This has always been the case. Might I remind you that computing was full of women? That’s how it started. What did boys do? They came in, kicked all the women out. Took over and then invited their buddies. It gets worse because then it also became racist. This was never a surprise. The root cause was that terrible people came in and ….. SURPRISE …. behave terribly.

This is some of the most delusional and downright offensive stuff I’ve ever read and I don’t even want to begin to read some of the HN comments. And HN has had far worse discussions and articles on the front page. Most of us have never experienced the depressingly (yes actual clinical depression) horrible treatment that people have been experiencing either as potential employees or full time employees ever since those ENIAC days. Go look at your team. And then look at your other teams. And then your line of management. You’ll see the pattern. Now go back and look at history for the same things. You’ll once again see the same thing. It’s the same people. Young terrible hateful xenophobic racist homophobic freaks grew up and continued their ways. Nerds being the good guy is as cringe as the incel nice guy. Yuck.

Our industry is rotten because it has rotten people all through the ranks. It’s not just CEOs or founders. It’s everyday working people who are terrible to each other. And sorry to say but nerds geeks whatever you want to call them are at the top of the most terrible. That’s what make this industry suck. We never actually sat down and told most of these people (and us) to goto a therapist and deal with our trauma, demons, etc. and stop propagating that hurt to others. Start there.

Oh and this is the same blog with a different URL from 2 days ago and commenter pointed out. Yikes.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#354
post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Academia is the most relevant, toxic example that I can think of. Be horrible to others on a short term contract (grad students, postdocs) and break them whilst extracting maximum value -- get more papers, more grants written -- more money -- success. Be nice, think about hard problems for a long period of time, only speak up when you have something positive to contribute -- be labelled an underperforming academic an…

The challenge is to distinguish "think about hard problems for a long period of time, only speak up when you have something positive to contribute" from slacking. I am not arguing for bullshit metrics - I personally love working on things that may or may not pay off on a 10 year+ horizon and wish I could do more of that. But at the same time I've seen enough people coast to accept that most places that either isn't -…

In the end we have to face that systems have failed to replace competent managers. If there isn't a chain of accountability starting at the top that can manage people without extensive justification in metrics and is properly incentivised to keep the organisation healthy, whatever we are left with will be gamed to the detriment of everyone.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#355

I don’t know why you’d think “being interested in nerdy stuff like computers” would somehow translate into virtuous behavior. They seem like entirely different things to me, in the sense that I wouldn’t expect a writer, or a baker, or a chef to have typical ethical behaviors as a group. “What happened” was just that some people got rich and powerful and their real personalities showed through. This is not a new thing…

Contrast matters. Being awake to bigotry and pseudoscience also predates the tech industry, TBF, but eugenics, "scientific" racism, etc. used to be a lot more common. Don't look down on people for expecting better now, even from people who apparently have unresolved issues about what happened in South Africa.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#356
Wow, this comment section alone speaks to how much things have changed.

As someone who started to read this forum because it was y-combinator startup-friendly, business-friendly and investor-friendly, I never would have imagined the anger and ridicule on display here.

Obviously, the nerds have left the building--or at least this forum.

Did anyone read this article?

"There is no reason founders should disappear from public life. There are too many advantages to building in public to ignore it."

Someone has to say this: don't be a victim--get out there and build something valuable for yourself.

There are no overlords, except in your imagination. Go build great things.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#357

I don’t know why you’d think “being interested in nerdy stuff like computers” would somehow translate into virtuous behavior. They seem like entirely different things to me, in the sense that I wouldn’t expect a writer, or a baker, or a chef to have typical ethical behaviors as a group. “What happened” was just that some people got rich and powerful and their real personalities showed through. This is not a new thing…

I don't think being nerdy makes someone virtuous, that's true. However, I think SV of 20-40 years ago had a distinct culture (best symbolized by Woz) that's basically been lost to the MBA-types and the hustle culture bros. Sometimes they wear it around like a creepy skin suit but it comes across as deeply inauthentic.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#358

I don’t know why you’d think “being interested in nerdy stuff like computers” would somehow translate into virtuous behavior. They seem like entirely different things to me, in the sense that I wouldn’t expect a writer, or a baker, or a chef to have typical ethical behaviors as a group. “What happened” was just that some people got rich and powerful and their real personalities showed through. This is not a new thing…

They seem like entirely different things to me, in the sense that I wouldn’t expect a writer, or a baker, or a chef to have typical ethical behaviors as a group. Shouldn't you? Bakers and chefs aren't just "interested in nerdy stuff like chemical reactions," they make food for people. Writers have ethical obligations, both individually and as a group? I don’t know why you’d think “being interested in nerdy stuff like…

oooh pinched a nerve among the xkcd fans I guess

Re: What happened to nerds?

#359
> This will probably catch on slower and be less viral, but it will pay off in the long-run once people 'turn against' tech founders as reality stars, which they eventually will.

The whole problem with opening Pandora's box is that you don't get to close it if you don't like what came out.

Why would things eventually get better? Especially on a time scale that matters to anyone who is currently alive?

Re: What happened to nerds?

#360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They seem like entirely different things to me, in the sense that I wouldn’t expect a writer, or a baker, or a chef to have typical ethical behaviors as a group. Shouldn't you? Bakers and chefs aren't just "interested in nerdy stuff like chemical reactions," they make food for people. Writers have ethical obligations, both individually and as a group? I don’t know why you’d think “being interested in nerdy stuff like…

>> I don’t know why you’d think “being interested in nerdy stuff like computers” would somehow translate into virtuous behavior. > The cultural perception of nerds being relentlessly bullied for the crime of having imaginations/GPAs/acne, I think, presented a culturally sympathetic view to the extent that the latent bro-ism caught some off guard, like we'd expect them to emerge from sweet gentle Stranger-Things style…

Yeah, exactly, "man hands on inhumanity to man" and all that. I have to admit I was a little surprised when I saw it firsthand, myself, so it's not like I was any less naive about it.
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