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Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

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Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#351

Post by lisbbb »

rayiner wrote: post #247
metadope wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the number of drivers in accidents with THC in their blood is going up because the number of people with THC in their blood is going up This. In just the short time since legalization, recreational use in my immediate vicinity (a small Ohio village, one stop light) has decidedly, undeniably increased. I offer only an anecdotal observation, but my evening walks around town are now accompanied by a dank potpourri of…

Same thing in DC. I thought the new development in DC where we lived had a major sewer gas problem. Turns out it was marijuana.

[flagged]

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#352

Post by sokoloff »

belorn wrote: post #347
Youden wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a larger discussion in a previous thread on this topic: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45494730 Since then, [0] has been published and I think it's worth at least a skim. Since it's quite recent the introduction summarizes some of the most recent research. The things that jump out at me are: - [0]: Habitual users with baseline concentrations above legal limits perform just as well as habitual users wi…

My preferred way to wade through a political research topic like this is to look at the aviation industry. If a pilot can not use a medical substance, then it is very likely that there is some thing there. Pilots are generally fairly high investment, and they are also fairly international in research and standards. All nations with an airforce tend also be interested in such research, regardless of current political…

I think that aviation has a lot of factors that bias its decisions conservatively. The “cost” of being conservative can be pretty easily borne in aviation. As an example, Zyrtec is grounding for 48 hours after taking. I think most Zyrtec users drive daily and likely quite safely, but aviation can afford to ground pilots at a lower level of risk than probably makes sense for drivers.

(I have very little doubt that THC is impairing; that pilots can’t legally use it is only very loosely related to that likely linkage.)

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#353

Post by boston_clone »

rayiner wrote: post #348
boston_clone wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuinely asking - had you never smelled cannabis before living in DC? To claim the odor is mistakable for sewer gas is borderline funny, unless you’re slyly trying to name a new strain.

I had never smelled it before. It smells identical to sewer gas to me—I know what that smells like because our house was missing several drain traps.

Fascinating. I wonder if this is a genetic thing similar to people who sense soap for cilantro, except with terpenes instead of aldehydes.

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#354

Post by flaminHotSpeedo »

laughing_man wrote: post #324

>The rate of drivers who tested positive for THC did not change significantly before or after legalization (42.1% vs. 45.2%), indicating that legal status did not influence the behavior of those who chose to drive after use. That being the case, I'm not sure what the policy prescription should be here, if any.

> 103 drivers (41.9%) overall tested positive for THC, with yearly rates ranging from 25.7% to 48.9%.

The statistics for this seem suspect at best, I'll believe it once it's peer reviewed

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#355

Post by cogman10 »

belorn wrote: post #347
Youden wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a larger discussion in a previous thread on this topic: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45494730 Since then, [0] has been published and I think it's worth at least a skim. Since it's quite recent the introduction summarizes some of the most recent research. The things that jump out at me are: - [0]: Habitual users with baseline concentrations above legal limits perform just as well as habitual users wi…

My preferred way to wade through a political research topic like this is to look at the aviation industry. If a pilot can not use a medical substance, then it is very likely that there is some thing there. Pilots are generally fairly high investment, and they are also fairly international in research and standards. All nations with an airforce tend also be interested in such research, regardless of current political…

I think you miss the point of the comment you replied to.

> The law's assumption that this level of THC is evidence of impairment seems to be invalid.

I think most will recognize that THC causes impairment. The question that (AFAIK) is unanswered is if it can be measured simply by looking at the concentration of THC in the blood.

In fact, if you look into the mechanisms for alcohol tolerance vs THC tolerance. What you'll find is that alcohol tolerance is a result of the body developing fast paths for breaking down ethanol. Meaning the same BAC will have the same intoxication level, the body just works harder to keep the BAC down.

THC tolerance, on the other hand, appears to be the THC receptors becoming desensitized to THC. Which means the body doesn't appear to metabolize THC faster as tolerance builds.

That's where a blood test might not be a good indicator of THC impairment.

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#356

Post by cogman10 »

boston_clone wrote: post #283
rayiner wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same thing in DC. I thought the new development in DC where we lived had a major sewer gas problem. Turns out it was marijuana.

Genuinely asking - had you never smelled cannabis before living in DC? To claim the odor is mistakable for sewer gas is borderline funny, unless you’re slyly trying to name a new strain.

The first time I smelt weed it reminded me of a skunk.

I could see how that might be mistaken as sewage.

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#357

Post by loeg »

dragonwriter wrote: post #305
loeg wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have world-leading criminality rates. Given that, the only alternatives are world-leading incarceration, or just letting criminals roam around making law-abiders' lives worse.

> We have world-leading criminality rates. That's what happens when you use criminalization and penal slavery to replace chattel slavery.

Progressive love to repeat this, but it doesn't make it true.

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#358

Post by cogman10 »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #326
graeme wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the population of dead drivers with over the limit THC is 40%, and this dramatically exceeds the population average, that would strongly suggest the THC level IS an indicator of either: 1. Impairment from THC, or 2. Worse than average driving and risk management skills in those who use the drug

Do we know what the THC levels are in (1) drivers who didn't die, and (2) the population in general? It could just be that 40% of the population is over the limit on THC all the time. Unless we can compare this against something else, and we can somehow normalize the comparison for other factors like age, I don't know how we can use the data.

This is a knowable thing, it just needs to be studied (I'm actually surprised it's not been TBH). Give people a standard set of coordination tests and then draw their blood to see what the THC level is.

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#359

Post by nobody9999 »

woodruffw wrote: post #145
master_crab wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven’t seen driving behavior change in NYC over the past two decades. Also, NYC has a different driving attitude than, say, Dallas. What people call aggression is often a difference in expectations. Drivers change lanes and merge far more assertively than in other parts of the country. As long as you aren’t causing the car behind you to panic brake, it’s considered acceptable. Hesitation from drivers tends to get…

I’ve lived here my entire life, and there’s a significant difference between normal “aggressive” driving and many of the driving patterns that have emerged post-COVID. For example: blocking the box is (unfortunately) somewhat normal, while running through red lights and making illegal turns has (anecdotally) increased significantly.

As the old saw about driving in NYC goes:

Green means 'Go!'

Yellow means 'Go faster!'

Red means 'The next six cars may go through the intersection.'

Okay, the third part is a little hyperbolic.

The above is from the 1980s and AFAICT (I've lived here nearly 60 years) not much has changed.

Re: Over 40% of deceased drivers in vehicle crashes test positive for THC: Study

#360

Post by QuercusMax »

michael1999 wrote: post #246
Sparkle-san wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not quite the same though. The claim is that because I'm a habitual user, I'm always impaired. Which amounts to over 100k miles of impaired driving over the last decade.

Planning, good sense, and caution go a long way to compensate for physical impairment. Weed is different from booze in that booze increases risk taking, which makes driving such a danger. But that doesn’t mean weed doesn’t impair in some material way compared to baseline.

Your average driver on alcohol: goes 100 miles per hour into a tree

Your average driver on weed: drives 5 miles per hour to the taco bell drive thru

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