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Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

moonshotai.github.io

351–360 of 442 posts

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#351
post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't work like that. An analogy would be giving a 5 year old a task that requires the understanding of the world of an 18 year old. It doesn't matter whether you give that child 5 minutes or 10 hours, they won't be capable of solving it.

What if you give them 13 years?

Nothing will change. They will go out of context and collapse into loops.

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I'm tired of this ol' propaganda trope. * We're leading the world in fusion research. https://www.pppl.gov/news/2025/wendelstein-7-x-sets-new-perf... * Our satellites are giving us by far the best understanding of our universe, capturing one third of the visible sky in incredible detail - just check out this mission update video if you want your mind blown: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXCBFlIpvfQ * Not only that,…

I’m confused. Who is this “We”? Do you realize how behind in many respects most of Europe is? How it’s been parceled up and destroyed by the EU? Science projects led by a few countries doesn’t cut it.

It’s not propaganda at all. The standards of living there are shit. But enjoy the particle collider, I guess?

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#353
post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't work like that. An analogy would be giving a 5 year old a task that requires the understanding of the world of an 18 year old. It doesn't matter whether you give that child 5 minutes or 10 hours, they won't be capable of solving it.

but in 13 years, will they be capable?

No. They will go out of context and collapse into loops.

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't work like that. An analogy would be giving a 5 year old a task that requires the understanding of the world of an 18 year old. It doesn't matter whether you give that child 5 minutes or 10 hours, they won't be capable of solving it.

I think the question of what can be achieved with a small model comes down to what needs knowledge vs what needs experience. A small model can use tools like RAG if it is just missing knowledge, but it seems hard to avoid training/parameters where experience is needed - knowing how to perceive then act. There is obviously also some amount (maybe a lot) of core knowledge and capability needed even to be able to ask th…

Small models handle simple, low context tasks most of the time correctly. But for more complex tasks, they fail due to insufficient training capacity and too few parameters to integrate the necessary relationships.

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s a lot of indications that we’re currently brute forcing these models. There’s honestly not a reason they have to be 1T parameters and cost an insane amount to train and run on inference. What we’re going to see is as energy becomes a problem; they’ll simply shift to more effective and efficient architectures on both physical hardware and model design. I suspect they can also simply charge more for the service…

There are also elements of stock price hype and geopolitical competition involved. The major U.S. tech giants are all tied to the same bandwagon — they have to maintain this cycle: buy chips → build data centers → release new models → buy more chips. It might only stop once the electricity problem becomes truly unsustainable. Of course, I don’t fully understand the specific situation in the U.S., but I even feel that…

Sundar is talking about fleeing earth to secure photons and cooling in space.

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm tired of this ol' propaganda trope. * We're leading the world in fusion research. https://www.pppl.gov/news/2025/wendelstein-7-x-sets-new-perf... * Our satellites are giving us by far the best understanding of our universe, capturing one third of the visible sky in incredible detail - just check out this mission update video if you want your mind blown: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXCBFlIpvfQ * Not only that,…

I’m confused. Who is this “We”? Do you realize how behind in many respects most of Europe is? How it’s been parceled up and destroyed by the EU? Science projects led by a few countries doesn’t cut it. It’s not propaganda at all. The standards of living there are shit. But enjoy the particle collider, I guess?

We is Europe. Like everywhere else, we are behind in some aspects and ahead in others.

> The standards of living there are shit.

Now you're just trolling. I've lived in both the US and in multiple EU countries. Let me tell you, the standard of living in the US does not hold a candle to the one in the EU.

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, by "structured" I mean how it wants to do ChatGPT-style output with headings and emoji and lists and stuff. And the punchy style of K2 0905 as shown in the fiction example in the linked article is what I really dislike. K2 Thinking's output in that example seems a lot more natural. I'd be totally on board if cut straight to the answer with natural sounding prose, as you described, but for whatever reason that h…

From what I've heard, Kimi K2 0905 was a major downgrade for writing. So, when you hear people recommend Kimi K2 for writing, it's likely that they recommend the first release, 0711, and not the 0905 update.

Interesting. As others have noted, it has a cut straight to the point non-psychophantic style that I find exceptionally rich in detailey and impressive. But it sounds like you're saying an earlier version was even better.

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weights are meaningless without training data and source.

I get a lot of meaning out of weights and source (without the training data), not sure about you. Calling it meaning less seems like exaggeration.

Can you change the weights to improve?

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#359
post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...and my point is that it should be. the practice of science itself would be far stronger if it took more pages from open source software culture.

I agree that they should say "open weight" instead of "open source" when that's what they mean, but it might take some time for people to understand that it's not the same thing exactly and we should allow some slack for that.

no. truly open source models are wonderful and remarkable things that truly move the needle in education, understanding, distributed collaboration and the advancement of the state of the art. redefinition of the terminology reduces incentive to strive for the wonderful goal that they represent.

Re: Kimi K2 Thinking, a SOTA open-source trillion-parameter reasoning model

#360
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are westerners so single mindedly obsessed about this decades old event?

First it's an easy way to test censorship. Second, you might flip the question: why is the Chinese govt so obsessed that they still block all mention of the event?

I don’t get why the government doesn’t recognize the event and then mold it to its narrative, like so many other governments do.

They basically need to give it the Hollywood treatment.

I’m sure a lot of people don’t know that prior to the event, the protesters lynched and set soldiers on fire.

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