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Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

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Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#351

Post by bobfunk »

aurareturn wrote: post #331
bobfunk wrote: post #317

Netlify CEO here. Our support team has reached out to the user from the thread to let them know they're not getting charged for this. It's currently our policy to not shut down free sites during traffic spikes that doesn't match attack patterns, but instead forgiving any bills from legitimate mistakes after the fact. Apologies that this didn't come through in the initial support reply.

There are only two questions everyone have: 1. Would Netlify forgive the bill if this didn't go viral? 2. How do you plan to address this issue so that it never happens again? Everyone here knew someone from Netlify would come and say OP wouldn't have to pay. That was a given. Now we want to know the important answers.

1. Yes. We've forgiven lots and lots of bills over the last 9 years and they haven't gone viral

2. While I've always favored erring towards keeping people's sites up we are currently working on changing the default behavior to never let free sites incur overages

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#352

Post by kiprou »

bobfunk wrote: post #317

Netlify CEO here. Our support team has reached out to the user from the thread to let them know they're not getting charged for this. It's currently our policy to not shut down free sites during traffic spikes that doesn't match attack patterns, but instead forgiving any bills from legitimate mistakes after the fact. Apologies that this didn't come through in the initial support reply.

That customers must seek forgiveness at Netlify's discretion is not comforting. What's comforting is dependable spending controls.

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#353

Post by redbell »

ji_zai wrote: post #74

This is my worst nightmare as a bootstrapped founder. And that there's no way to put a limit on spend is ridiculous. Someone that doesn't want me to do well can simply ddos me into bankruptcy out of nowhere. Just went through Vercel's docs: --- "Vercel helps to mitigate against L3 and L4 DDoS attacks at the platform level. Usage will be incurred for requests that are successfully served prior to us automatically miti…

> Someone that doesn't want me to do well can simply ddos me into bankruptcy out of nowhere.

An interesting story that expands on the above concept but a different vector entitled, "Illegal Life Pro Tip: Want to ruin your competitors business?" : https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36566634

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#354

Post by nindalf »

factorialboy wrote: post #77
nindalf wrote: post #44

Since the author has gone viral I expect some netlify exec is going to take over and write this bill off to $0. In the words of Kramer “these big companies, they just write it off!” A moment of silence for the people who got DDoS-ed, didn’t go viral and still had to pay $5k.

You don't even know what a write-off is.

Do you?

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#355

Post by dkarras »

hayst4ck wrote: post #65

Defaulting to unbounded liability as the standard operating procedure for cloud infrastructure should be illegal.

looks like it is not just defaulting to unbounded liability. it is forcing unbounded liability as there is no way to turn it off and limit your exposure.

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#356

Post by fabian2k »

bobfunk wrote: post #317

Netlify CEO here. Our support team has reached out to the user from the thread to let them know they're not getting charged for this. It's currently our policy to not shut down free sites during traffic spikes that doesn't match attack patterns, but instead forgiving any bills from legitimate mistakes after the fact. Apologies that this didn't come through in the initial support reply.

You can't rely on such a policy if it is not part of the actual contract. This doesn't address the enormous uncertainty and risk that is present here when using Netlify.

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#357

Post by mchinen »

aurareturn wrote: post #331
bobfunk wrote: post #317

Netlify CEO here. Our support team has reached out to the user from the thread to let them know they're not getting charged for this. It's currently our policy to not shut down free sites during traffic spikes that doesn't match attack patterns, but instead forgiving any bills from legitimate mistakes after the fact. Apologies that this didn't come through in the initial support reply.

There are only two questions everyone have: 1. Would Netlify forgive the bill if this didn't go viral? 2. How do you plan to address this issue so that it never happens again? Everyone here knew someone from Netlify would come and say OP wouldn't have to pay. That was a given. Now we want to know the important answers.

From the 5% reduction it seems (1) was less likely.

To bobfunk, the response needs more empathy and explanation around the obvious frustration around why there is no slider for cost limitation.

As it is, it feels like the minimum viable corpspeak apology and damage control.

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#358

Post by CogitoCogito »

bobfunk wrote: post #317

Netlify CEO here. Our support team has reached out to the user from the thread to let them know they're not getting charged for this. It's currently our policy to not shut down free sites during traffic spikes that doesn't match attack patterns, but instead forgiving any bills from legitimate mistakes after the fact. Apologies that this didn't come through in the initial support reply.

> It's currently our policy to not shut down free sites during traffic spikes that doesn't match attack patterns, but instead forgiving any bills from legitimate mistakes after the fact.

The legitimate mistake sounds to be on _your_ side if anything. You failed to match the attack pattern after all.

> Apologies that this didn't come through in the initial support reply.

The support email said you normally discount the attacks to 20%, but in this case it would be discounted to 5%. Are you here publicly claiming that your policy is to in fact to forgive (i.e. discount 100%) these bills? Was the support reply totally incorrect in claiming that you normally discount the attacks to 20% or are you lying when saying that your policy is to forgive the bills? You might want to clarify your position here.

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#359

Post by Reelix »

binsquare wrote: post #8

That discount to 5% is incredibly odd and hand wavy, I would escalate to their manager. They should definitely be able to accomodate and account for what should be a very common issue (does).

They can discount to 5% since their fees are 10,000% higher than what it's costing them...

Re: Netlify just sent me a $104k bill for a simple static site

#360

Post by CogitoCogito »

bobfunk wrote: post #351
aurareturn wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are only two questions everyone have: 1. Would Netlify forgive the bill if this didn't go viral? 2. How do you plan to address this issue so that it never happens again? Everyone here knew someone from Netlify would come and say OP wouldn't have to pay. That was a given. Now we want to know the important answers.

1. Yes. We've forgiven lots and lots of bills over the last 9 years and they haven't gone viral 2. While I've always favored erring towards keeping people's sites up we are currently working on changing the default behavior to never let free sites incur overages

> 1. Yes. We've forgiven lots and lots of bills over the last 9 years and they haven't gone viral

This isn't what you said in your first post, you said:

> It's currently our policy to not shut down free sites during traffic spikes that doesn't match attack patterns, but instead forgiving any bills from legitimate mistakes after the fact.

So forgiving "lots and lots" doesn't move the needle. Do you or do you not forgive _all_ such cases where your DDOS protection doesn't take down the site? What was your employee referring to when saying that the usual discount is 20%? Are you saying that you _never_ discount 20% and instead always discount 100% i.e. "forgive"?

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