A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

Post by owisd » Mon, Jul 31, 2023, 5:11 PM UTC

karaterobot wrote: post #315

Qwertious wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>* Consumers who care more about convenience and cost above all else, and reliability basically not at all Don't blame the consumer for this. It's just The Market For Lemons at work. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Market_for_Lemons If you really need someone to blame, then blame the MBAs who buy up quality brands and then sell junk until the reputation is all ground up.

This isn't a relevant paper, not only because it's not about home appliances, but because it's about a situation where there is information asymmetry. I can research everything I need to know about a refrigerator before buying it, including whether it's a piece of junk or not.

Post by amluto » Mon, Jul 31, 2023, 5:16 PM UTC

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #211

amluto wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> new stuff that came out in the last 20 years. There isn’t really that much of this. Let’s consider an oven: Good temperature control: accurate, precise and reliable temperature sensors (e.g. thermocouples) have been around for a long time, as have switching devices that are plenty high speed to make an excellent oven. PID control would be easy with 1980 technology or current technology. Ovens with good temperature…

> The only thing $7k buys you is a nice brand name and maybe slightly more solid construction than a much cheaper unit.) Typically you also get: more BTUs, better simmer control, easier repairability (due to construction design). I'm not arguing it's worth the money (which is why I got my $15k stove from craigslist for $2k :)

Post by amluto » Mon, Jul 31, 2023, 5:21 PM UTC

rsynnott wrote: post #264

amluto wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> new stuff that came out in the last 20 years. There isn’t really that much of this. Let’s consider an oven: Good temperature control: accurate, precise and reliable temperature sensors (e.g. thermocouples) have been around for a long time, as have switching devices that are plenty high speed to make an excellent oven. PID control would be easy with 1980 technology or current technology. Ovens with good temperature…

Yeah, ovens last more or less forever, and haven't had significant efficiency gains in a long time. They're probably the thing you're least likely to want to replace. There's often far more of an incentive with, say, fridges; if you have a 20 year old one, the replacement will likely pay for itself in a few years in power savings. > The obvious safety mechanism to turn off the gas if the burner isn’t lit? Nonexistent…

Post by michaelt » Mon, Jul 31, 2023, 5:22 PM UTC

r0fl wrote: post #171

michaelt wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you can still buy high-end fridges or first class tickets if you are willing to spend the same amount Can you, though? Or has the maker of that high-end $1500 fridge been brought out by the maker of $500 fridges? Are the two brands made in the same factory, to the same quality standards, while the owners laugh at those chumps who are paying 3x the price just to have a different sticker on the front? I've brought hi…

You can buy column fridge / freezers from sub zero, thermador, miele that are about $20,000-$30,000 (price in Canada) with complete different quality standards

Post by momirlan » Mon, Jul 31, 2023, 5:23 PM UTC

JohnFen wrote: post #338

In my opinion, most (but certainly not all) manufactured things from 70 years were much better than the same manufactured things now are. Things now are cheaper, of course. But I'm far from convinced that's a good thing. It means that the things are disposable, and it's one of the things that is advancing ecological destruction.