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EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

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Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#351

Post by prirun »

Sakos wrote: post #286
londons_explore wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is, with current 'privacy-protecting scanner' designs, the scanner is running on every end users device, and it would be fairly simple for an expert to dump out the list of things being looked for. That in turn makes such a system far less useful to intelligence services and authoritarian regimes. You don't want to tell your target that you're looking for them and which keywords not to use! I wonder if this…

The EU is constantly pushing to backdoor encryption and allow them unfettered access to communication in flight. Local CSAM is just a stepping stone.

I find it ironic that people often look at the EU as "privacy-focused", with things like the GDPR, while at the same time the EU wants encryption backdoors and photo scanning.

IMO, the politicians just want more authority and power. The GDPR gives them power to sue and fine large companies, ie, free money. I don't think it's about privacy any more than encryption backdoors are about fighting crime or photo scanning is about protecting children.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#352

Post by taylorius »

Don't get me wrong, the EU never met a piece of snooping legislation they didn't like, but the fact that the top part of the page is trying to sell me some encrypted email address makes me wonder about the article's editorial integrity...

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#353

Post by throwaway0a5e »

smolder wrote: post #337
throwaway0a5e wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drawing such a line is unfortunately fundamentally incompatible with current western attitudes. You need to be able to have adult discussions about death and harm that WILL happen at the scales we're talking about. These harms are often easy to calculate. The harms that come from surveillance dragnets are less immediate and harder to calculate. So in addition to be able to have a discussion that we're incapable of ha…

> we also need to have the balls to say "this long term non-specific harm of the surveillance state is worse than a few kids getting abused". There is a false assumption here that such a surveillance program would even be effective and not just a stepping stone to arguing for more invasive measures when it doesn't fix anything. The better argument is "this long term non-specific harm of government surveillance is wor…

>There is a false assumption here that such a surveillance program would even be effective and not just a stepping stone to arguing for more invasive measures when it doesn't fix anything.

It's a false assumption you're gonna have to argue against so get used to it. In the minds of people who want this crap the harm of a surveillance state is not a guaranteed thing. They think there will be "reasonable access controls" and other fantasy stuff like that.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#354

Post by adamsmith143 »

kmlx wrote: post #256
crmd wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoting Adam Curtis from The Power of Nighmares: > In the past, politicians promised to create a better world. They had different ways of achieving this, but their power and authority came from the optimistic visions they offered their people. Those dreams failed and today people have lost faith in ideologies. Increasingly, politicians are seen simply as managers of public life, but now they have discovered a new rol…

> They had a great 20 year run on the terrorism narrative, but they need a new nightmare, and they’ve apparently settled on child predators. just a second, we've got the new Russia - Ukraine nightmare.

>just a second, we've got the new Russia - Ukraine nightmare.

Find a Ukrainian living through the war and ask them if it's a manufactured nightmare or a real one...

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#355

Post by nix23 »

peoplefromibiza wrote: post #319
nix23 wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Law enforcement forces and justice system employees only have to obey to the laws, not to the politicians in power. Frontex want's to have a word with you..... And the Italian coastguard let people drown because it's law?....or maybe because it's a political thing? You cant separate the government and justice system completely.

> Frontex want's to have a word with you..... Let's hear your thesis here... > And your Italian coastguard let people drown because it's law?.... They actually don't. Some politician (a Trump and Putin supporter, BTW!) tried to make them drawn for political gains and was beaten by a German young Captain Woman. [1] many people in Europe protested against what Salvini was doing. [2] [3] [4] France officially condemned…

>They actually don't.

Since your talking about Rackete....

>>The EU is no longer rescuing drowning migrants and the number of refugees continues to fall.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/carola-rackete-a...

You know that's why she got into troubles?...bringing drowning refugees to europa's coast.

>many people in Europe protested against what Salvini was doing.

So here you gave already proof that politicians can tell the coast guard what todo right?...because the sea-law is pretty clear..you have to help, no matter what.

Thank you for the proof.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#356

Post by mhh__ »

eru wrote: post #229
ThePowerOfFuet wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely brilliant series, and highly recommended. Available on the Internet Archive. https://archive.org/details/ThePowerOfNightmares-AdamCurtis

I have watched 'All Watched Over by Machines of Loving Grace' by the same guy. If that stuff is anything to go by, Adam Curtis long on insinuation and clever cuts, and short on actual insight. Beware of Gell-Mann Amnesia. Btw, I suspect politicians always used the protection-from-nightmares just as much as promising utopia.

I agree. Curtis complains about narrative building and hypernormalisation, when he is arguably doing both of those things every time he speaks.

The tune of the poem is more important than the words to him.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#357

Post by nix23 »

peoplefromibiza wrote: post #308
nix23 wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Those who tried, failed miserably. Ah you think the government sends an official person and start to blackmailing you? >Justice system here is not run by governments, it's a completely separated power. Oh c'mon, it's pretty naive to think like that. >They control everything in the control rooms, which is not even the case oin EU democracies. Ah yes the russian control room's who had not heard of that. >which is not…

> Ah you think the government sends an official person and start to blackmailing you? You mean governments are run by criminals that break the law? If being blackmailed over alleged pedo pornography in that case is what concerns you the most, I think you have a pretty simplistic view of what's happening in the real World right now... > I really cant believe that you think the EU is so much better. I really can't beli…

>You just posted propaganda links of a commercial

Ah yeah...the old propaganda because you have to implement backdoors in your encrypted email-service...i don't know what you try to proof here, but it's kind of disgusting.

>You mean governments are run by criminals that break the law?

Ever heard of Berlusconi? Or maybe Nixon....or your King Juan Carlos ;)

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#358

Post by maybeOneDay »

_Algernon_ wrote: post #201
newsclues wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Encrypted data will be illegal for plebs. Failure to hand over passwords will be punished as if you are guilty of the worst thing imaginable.

I doubt it because at that point they cant pretend anymore to have rule of law, or being a democracy. Sure, it could be a gradual decent into such a reality, but it will take a long time.

It's already illegal to not disclose passwords when ordered to do so in the UK.

Sure, the US freedom of speech amendment protects more powerfully than in most countries. But I wouldn't be so confident once the rest of the world has given up

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#359

Post by MattJ100 »

kornhole wrote: post #346

How can they scan messages on my xmpp server using OMEMO e2ee?

They can't. They just want to make it illegal for you not to scan them if they decide you are a communication provider and they serve you with what they call a "detection order". If you receive such an order, you have to follow the scanning rules they have laid out.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#360

Post by kingcharles »

Freak_NL wrote: post #47

It's scary, because CSAM (child sexual abuse material) is very, very broad, and quite vague in its definition¹. My three year old son stayed with my parents for a week, and he was being taught to swim in their swimming pool. Of course, I get sent pictures and clips of his progress by a proud grandma, and of course, him being a toddler, he felt swimming trunks to be completely optional (and of course, they are at his…

I personally know someone who spent 13 years in prison because at 18 his 16 year old girlfriend sent him a nude selfie. Her Mom was in her phone and saw that she had sent the photos, so she called the police on her daughter's boyfriend. They arrested him, seized his phone and found the photo.
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