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Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

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Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reminds me of when GitHub kicked out a paying customer for using the word "retard" as a verb in the mathematical sense.

Large planes tell pilots vocally to “retard” when landing…

Which can be amusing if you don't know what's going on, it suddenly sounds like the autopilot is pissed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmbzKsqKQoI

And for those who would like to change this, any change to a pilot's routine has a chance of being the thing that pushes an incident over the edge into a crash. Would it be worth it?

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#352
post #154

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One of the challenges with moderation teams like that or similar is that the folks who REALLY want to do that job .. are the folks who absolutely should NOT be doing it.

For anyone reading this, I volunteer. My moderation level would be based on words that were considered bad in the year 2005. I won’t have to do much work and you still get to say that you have someone that’s doing the job. Win-win.

I wonder what your age is in comparison to your chosen ideal of 2005. As I am getting older it is easier to see the patterns in all this. Most people just want the entire world frozen from the time they were young. That includes everything from the cast of SNL to acceptable language. I have seen enough decades of people complaining about policing language to know that we survived multiple waves of this before 2005 and we will survive all the waves that came and will come after. I would bet that 20 years from now, Gen Z will be waxing nostalgic about the language of today while Gen Alpha and beyond will be pushing for more change. It is just the way language evolves.

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#353
post #190
post #98

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Not only that, but there are more than three times as many slaves TODAY as ever were in the transatlantic slave trade that is the only one the US knows exists.

There are more slaves added each year in the US today than at the peak of transatlantic trade: https://www.britannica.com/summary/Transatlantic-Slave-Trade... Peak transatlantic: 78,000 new slaves per year. https://thecurrentmsu.com/2021/01/24/prison-labor-americas-s... Current US forced prison labor population: 1-2.1 million.

It's really undermining the atrocities of the transatlantic slave trade by comparing it to prison. We wouldn't compare it to indentured servitude, which is much closer to the penal system (monetary debt vs social debt, but both are contacts even if not purely voluntary). The federal government also doesn't have complete ownership over prisoners. Yes, prisoners are mistreated, but what they face isn't at the level of those from the slave trade and so you're effectively diminishing those atrocities.

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can (i.e. you don't fear persecution), please let them know that this was the reason. Part of the reason these things have taken off is that their proponents are very vocal, while the opponents prefer to just mind their own business.

Absolutely do not do this. There is massive brigading that happens and the folks pushing the "anti-isms" are very very focused on this stuff. You will get on a list as some type of abuser / racist. Everyone knows to keep heads down on this stuff at a place like google or just find somewhere else to work. It really doesn't matter if you are liberal in all other ways even.

There's plenty of other companies that have the other side of the coin in values though that would admire people who stand up. It's very nice to be a good culture fit at a company. I have a Blue Lives Matter flag in the corner of my camera during interviews and it's gotten me some really good offers and I havn't been declined once.

On the flip side, I know many that have been discriminated based on their looks or vocal patterns(trans / lgbt). Alot of companies and people assume these people are a problem because of what goes on at google and decline them due to culture fit.

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#355
post #309

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I think they're trying to change language to disassociate "black" with negative meaning. Which is going to be very hard, because the reason for the association is from black being the unknown. It's the night that hides the predators. It's the shadow where the enemy hides. It's where you don't want to put your foot in case there are spiders or a sharp rock. Humans are afraid of the dark. I've not even heard of being a…

This makes sense to me. Why is it downvoted?

Probably because that's not the only possible interpretation of the issue.

I agree that in some instances, white seems to be primarily used as a synonym for bright/light, and black as one for darkness, shadow etc., such as in the case of white and black box testing.

However, other cases, such as "whitelist" and "blacklist", seem more nefarious at least in some cultures: A list of names, one of people to grant access to some service or facility, the other to be denied...

And as somebody else has already noted, for somebody without that cultural background, it might not even make any sense, unlike the much more self-describing alternatives "allowlist" and "denylist".

If there is an alternative available that is both more straightforward and that has less negative connotations – why not advocate for its use, and assume that those that do so do it out of good intentions (while at the same time not assuming that people using the other terms do so out of a desire to cause harm)?

The main problem seems to be that, as in many such cases, a nuanced discussion of the topic does not fit into a tweet or news headline, nor a Slackbot autoresponse, and least of all into a grammar checker.

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My opinion: `main` is better. It's shorter, it's more descriptive, and costs nothing to remove something someone might find offensive. It's pretty much an all around win.

Its worse because suddenly 20 years worth of tutorials are slightly 'wrong' and will confuse new users even more for no reason. "Why does my git say main and not master? Did I break it?" "Why cant I push to master like the 100x tutorials show? I get errors!"

This is when Ministry of Truth comes into play. The main character's job in 1984 was literally this: rewriting history when it came into conflict with the updated "truth". Orwell didn't foresee that in a world of computers, such updates are trivially made: no need to reprint newspapers and books, since all of them are virtual.

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On landlord I can’t think of a proper synonym. Property owner and proprietor are broader categories of what a landlord is. They don’t mean the person you’re paying rent to for your housing.

faucet-fixer?

paint-over-any-imperfections-er

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trans people are frequently in tech. Go to any college and you'll see the CompSci department is the one with the most amount of LGBT individuals. The same can't be said for people who are blind or deaf.

> Go to any college and you'll see the CompSci department is the one with the most amount of LGBT individuals. Do you have any data on that? It does not coincide with my anecdotal experience. I'm in a Math/CompSci department and there's zero trans people here (that I know of), while there are some in other departments. Anyhow, trans people are a tiny percentage of the total population, so it would be hard to have som…

Interesting. I don't have data, but it heavily correlates with my school and what I had heard from others. There was like a big cadre of trans people in the CompSci department, then a few in the Math department.

There was a smattering in other afaik. I was on the board of the LGBT club so I knew at least the ones who were out / came frequently.

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#359
post #9

In the article they use the example of "Motherboard" and "Landlord" and seem to suggest that these are areas where the Google AI is making mistakes or being overly strict. As a Google employee expressing my own opinion and observations of company culture, I can say that these are 100% not mistakes. Many Google employees are just so out of touch with the real world that they believe it is the duty of Google Docs to ch…

That's part of Marxist long march through institutions. They achieve these goals through bullying and accusations. Nobody at work wants to be (unfoundedly) accused of racism so they silently accept these new rules. I mean it's a small inconvenience that is probably worth the salary they are getting. But the truth is people in these organisations are afraid of speaking their minds in case they say something that is deemed wrong by woke police. I noticed that people have become less open and many limits conversations strictly to the tasks at hand. It's kind of how corporate goals meet with Marxism - they believe people no longer engage in "pointless" socialising that affects the bottom line and if they want to engage, they have a minefield to navigate. Many of my (former) friends who worked at these big corporations have become zombies - it's not possible to have a conversation with them about day to day life, events etc. It's really fascinating and worrying.

Re: Google’s AI-powered ‘inclusive warnings’ feature is very broken

#360
That's peak Google right there. It's the infection point on their organic growth. They've got a long tail of incumbency and subsidized dominance ahead of them, but in the lifecycle of a company, this is the out of touch moment that demonstrates they've passed their middle age. In terms of half life, this suggests they've got another decade of some vitality, and then a kind of legacy presence in the decade after that before their furniture gets picked up by something newer in a growth phase.

They would be well served to update their motto to, "Don't be fatuous." It's the best they can do now.

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