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Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

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Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#351

Post by snarfy »

Thorentis wrote: post #103

Unfortunately this project lacks two things which are essential to a long-lasting, sustainable, and human-friendly town. 1) Architecture that inspires, elevates the soul, and will last the test of time. All I see is soulless pre-fabs. It looks like you're living in a shopping mall. 2) The freedom to create buildings and institutions that are meaningful to the residents who reside there. Churches, schools, sporting cl…

We really just need the rules. The rest will grow organically. Why is our legal system so crappy that this cannot happen? Our legal system has everyone's hand in the pot and we end up with cities designed to extract maximum profit from its residents.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#352

Post by Wowfunhappy »

ethanbond wrote: post #216
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...I mean, we’ll have to agree to disagree on that! I really like the grid, it’s one of the reasons I like living here. Makes it so easy to navigate.

I’m not disagreeing with the functionality, and personally don’t find the grid to be particularly bad , but do you really think West Village isn’t dramatically more liveable feeling? I suppose this quickly veers into hard-to-define sensations so perhaps the point is moot :) I do suspect that a lot of people would prefer to live in that part of town over the more modern areas… as evidenced by the especially insane ren…

The village substantially more expensive than e.g. the upper west side? (These places are all outside of my price range so I've never really looked.)

There are also lots of other reasons the tip of manhattan may have been more expensive—for example, it's just the oldest part of the city, so everything started there and expanded outwards.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#353

Post by mikepurvis »

ShroudedNight wrote: post #282
mikepurvis wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue is that a lot of transit planning is politically motivated and done to maximize "coverage" rather than more meaningful metrics like ridership, usefulness, and profitability. Planning for coverage allows you to tell individual taxpayers that they're "served" by the transit they help fund, but most will never use it because it's infrequent and the routes take forever to get anywhere. Optimizing for ridership…

> The issue is that a lot of transit planning is politically motivated and done to maximize "coverage" rather than more meaningful metrics like ridership, usefulness, and profitability. That's definitely my experience in York Region (north of Toronto for those unfamiliar) and Ottawa. Far too many bus stops, but wait times > 15 minutes _per route_ outside all but the most peak parts of rush-hour. Including on their "b…

I enjoy taking LRT and buses in Waterloo Region, especially with my kids, but I think I go in expecting that there's a tradeoff— longer wait/travel time in exchange for being able to read on my kindle or play games on my phone on the way.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#354

Post by ethanbond »

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #352
ethanbond wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not disagreeing with the functionality, and personally don’t find the grid to be particularly bad , but do you really think West Village isn’t dramatically more liveable feeling? I suppose this quickly veers into hard-to-define sensations so perhaps the point is moot :) I do suspect that a lot of people would prefer to live in that part of town over the more modern areas… as evidenced by the especially insane ren…

The village substantially more expensive than e.g. the upper west side? (These places are all outside of my price range so I've never really looked.) There are also lots of other reasons the tip of manhattan may have been more expensive—for example, it's just the oldest part of the city, so everything started there and expanded outwards.

Yeah, according to Streeteasy West Village is about $1900/sqft and UWS is about $1400/sqft.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#355

Post by lotsofpulp »

55555 wrote: post #313
gautamcgoel wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've always been curious about Portland. The pictures are gorgeous but the headlines are scary.

A friend of mine just moved across the US to Portland because of all the hype and immediately left after being put off by what they described as a very public homelessness and hard drug problem.

That is anywhere with walkable, bikable, and dense living and temperate weather.

Without the ability to involuntarily commit people to mental healthcare facilities, or jail, the only other option is to live somewhere that is less hospitable to homeless people.

And building more to give free / cheap housing to the homeless people who do not need mental healthcare or jail is not going to work on a city or state level, especially in highly desirable areas due to induced demand.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#356

Post by scrumper »

The very first picture (next to "The Heart of the Community" reminds me a lot of one of those neo-primitive settlements the Enterprise would visit in a Star Trek: TNG episode. Captain Picard would have some kind of intense relationship with a local lady and everyone would learn something about the value of the simple life.

But more seriously, won't this be like living in a vacation resort? Fine for a week or two, but a bit grating after that. One restaurant, one grocery store...

The car-freeness is amazing but it seems a little small to be really livable. I am glad that someone is trying and paving a trail - we need things like this.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#357

Post by Wowfunhappy »

ethanbond wrote: post #354
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The village substantially more expensive than e.g. the upper west side? (These places are all outside of my price range so I've never really looked.) There are also lots of other reasons the tip of manhattan may have been more expensive—for example, it's just the oldest part of the city, so everything started there and expanded outwards.

Yeah, according to Streeteasy West Village is about $1900/sqft and UWS is about $1400/sqft.

...that might not be the best metric, I bet there are fewer super small apartments to be had on the UWS! I know the village has a fair number of places that were built before current laws about minimum square feet per apartment.

I don't know what the right metric would be—maybe median rent or even family income? I guess I also don't really think you can tell much from all this.)

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#358

Post by brewdad »

deltasixeight wrote: post #297
closeparen wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American suburbia is exactly as planning codes require it to be. It's just hard to imagine that they could be this bad.

Those aren't "planning" codes, it's more rules and guidelines. Development is still largely free and left to the market so long as they stick within the guidelines.

It's those rules and guidelines that make suburbia so miserable though. When you can't build retail without 1 off-street parking spot per 100 sq ft or new residential without 1.5 parking spaces per bedroom, then there is no possible outcome other than the car-dependence we see today. Parking requirements make building a walkable town impossible.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#359

Post by Natsu »

caskstrength wrote: post #321
imtringued wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have not biked in 50C weather but I have to say this: Going fast on a bike has a cooling effect. Cars need ACs because they are a mobile greenhouse.

> I have not biked in 50C weather but I have to say this: Going fast on a bike has a cooling effect. Only if air temperature is less than your body temperature, which is not the case when it is 50C outside. Going fast in 50C would feel like blowing a hairdryer in your face.

The air in Phoenix is dry enough that you get cooling from your sweat evaporating and the only humid days come after rainstorms which themselves cool things down.

But my point was more that this is only doable for the younger and healthier types. A lot of the people who go to live in Phoenix are retired midwesterners.

Re: Culdesac Tempe: The first car-free neighborhood built from scratch in the US

#360

Post by brewdad »

batoure wrote: post #335
slg wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For sake of comparison, Wikipedia says Daybreak is over 4000 acres while Culdesac is 16. These projects aren't close in scale and I think the "neighborhood" in the marketing for Culdesac is misleading regarding what life would actually be like living there. There are several individual buildings in my neighborhood that house more people and I still need a car on a regular basis.

Agreed on some digging Culdesac is very clearly just a “rebranded apartment complex” their units are only for rent nothing like a stand alone house is available and as far as the retailers/restaurants the ones listed will occupy the only spaces built for that purpose… its an apartment complex

Agreed. If their residents don't all end up as students at ASU, then they are going to NEED cars as well. The light rail covers maybe 5% of the metro area and the bus service is terrible if you need to travel more than a few miles.

I'm not aware of any significant employers nearby, aside from the university and a lot of minimum wage retail jobs. I suppose airport workers could make this location work, if they can afford it.

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