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Why Russians do not smile (2002)

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Re: Why Russians do not smile (2002)

#351

Post by NicoJuicy »

Gene_Parmesan wrote: post #325
Merem wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"After all, how could I genuinely wish a random German stranger a "Guten Morgen"..." By being a nice person, just like how one would hold open a door for someone else? Though, that aside, when you say "Guten Morgen", you aren't wishing anything. It's just being polite while at the same time, you are saying something about yourself. For example, you could simply say "Morgen" which would mean you are in a hurry, or, de…

This is exactly how "How are you?" is meant in American culture. It's not fake; greetings are culturally determined and especially the most common greeting phrases in any culture should not be treated literally but instead as part of a ritual exchange. "How are you?" "I'm well, and you?" "Great, thanks." It's just a ritualistic exchange.

It's not just American. It's very similar at least in Belgium and I suppose on other western countries too

Re: Why Russians do not smile (2002)

#353

Post by vinay427 »

scrollaway wrote: post #300
solipsism wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A Hindu pm had the habit of sitting next to developers while they worked, sometimes putting a hand on their knee Eh... That doesn't sound like just an Indian being Indian. a Japanese guy came to the hr person complaining the original lady from us had hugged them. Again, it was explained that this is just what Americans do Nope... We don't hug people who don't want to be hugged. The Japanese guy was right to complain,…

Never seen such a lack of self-awareness in a comment. And I've been here quite a while! Americans having to adjust to other people's cultures. Imagine that.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I'm genuinely not sure how the comment you replied to is implying that? I read it as saying the US woman should have adjusted her behavior.

Re: Why Russians do not smile (2002)

#354

Post by Merem »

kmarc wrote: post #338
Merem wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"After all, how could I genuinely wish a random German stranger a "Guten Morgen"..." By being a nice person, just like how one would hold open a door for someone else? Though, that aside, when you say "Guten Morgen", you aren't wishing anything. It's just being polite while at the same time, you are saying something about yourself. For example, you could simply say "Morgen" which would mean you are in a hurry, or, de…

The accusative case in guteN indeed comes from wishing it for the other (English is grammatically not expressive enough here). This is the same BTW in Hungarian. Even better, in HU we still have the form of "I wish (you) a good{Acc} morning", however a bit less formal way you can say just "a good{Acc} morning" This simplification happened to German earlier too. In fact, my German old lady neighbor still to this day s…

Yes and no. It does come from the longform well-wishing but it has been a separate greeting for a decently long time which is reflected by the fact that "guten Morgen" became "Guten Morgen" in the spelling reform 25 years ago. (Though, they did allow both variants a decade later (as is the case with a lot of other words), "Guten Morgen" is still the recommended one.) So that means if you are wishing someone a good morning, you are wishing someone a good morning + greeting. If it is just a good morning, it really is just a good morning (for you) + greeting. I do use both variants but actually wishing someone well is more reserved for people I've been interacting with for a long time (like certain cashiers in a supermarket (if there is time) or employees of a bakery), really friendly strangers or special cases (like someone is being a dick and one is being sarcastic).

Re: Why Russians do not smile (2002)

#355

Post by vinay427 »

durnygbur wrote: post #340
andreskytt wrote: post #256

Estonian here. At Skype (10+ years ago) I observed, that members of large cultures (American, British, Hindu etc.) had real trouble adjusting to the predominantly Estonian-based engineering culture. Probably because they had never had to adjust, commonly people adjust to _their_ culture as it tends to dominate large organizations. But once they did make an honest attempt, that was always most welcomed and gained them…

I would love to work in European international corporation acknowledging and respecting different introvert/extrovert personality levels, countless languages, completely different approaches in handling problems and challenges determined by one's origin and upbringing, different needs in socializing, e.g. Nokia at its peak. I dislike the American corporate environment, their soulless "corporate culture" media materia…

> I dislike the American corporate environment, their soulless "corporate culture" media materials. There is this one American school of "how to become successful" and that's it.

Ironically, a lot of people in the European country in which I live feel this way about domestic companies compared to the vibrancy of US corporate culture. Maybe you can elaborate on what you're referring to, preferably with less generalizing of a whole continent of corporate cultures as "European?"

Re: Why Russians do not smile (2002)

#356

Post by sirfz »

dragonwriter wrote: post #298
dTal wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is no surprise that the English word is shorter, as - unlike English - Russian has two words for "why". "почему" asks - how did things come to be this way? "зачем" asks - what is the purpose of things being this way? Note the difference in implication if I ask you "why" you were late for work. "почему" allows room for circumstances beyond your control, while "зачем" places the blame squarely on your shoulders. Eng…

> Unlike English, Russian has two words for "why". English has at least three in the same space, two of which are in modern use. > "почему" asks - how did things come to be this way? In English, that's, unambiguously, “How". Which is kind of why your own translation starts with it. > "зачем" asks - what is the purpose of things being this way? In English that is, again unambiguously, though somewhat archaic, “wherefo…

"Pochemu" is closer to "why" than "how", it asks why something happened regardless of how.

"zachem" is closer to "what for".

Re: Why Russians do not smile (2002)

#358

Post by fsloth »

asymmetric wrote: post #350
solipsism wrote: post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would I need more information? A guy was putting his hand on his co-workers' knees! Often enough that people scurried from him! It's clear the implication is made that this is just a "Hindu" thing. That's wrong. It's not a Hindu thing. It's offensive to say it is. And the idea that my comments saying so are being flagged is also offensive. Comments like Eh... Can't we just bomb them as usual? ;-) are the ones tha…

> A guy was putting his hand on his co-workers' knees! Oh my god!

I perceive "hand on knees" gesture either as an intimate sensual caress, or unwanted groping and borderline sexual harassment.

Is "hand on knee" just a friendly way to position yourself when talking to someone in some cultures (so I know what to expect)?

Re: Why Russians do not smile (2002)

#359

Post by wruza »

Wxc2jjJmST9XWWL wrote: post #223

Quite a lot of US culture can come off as phony to (Eastern) Europeans. Friend of mine went to the US for a business schooling event and said people were completely incapable of honest criticism. They would sugar coat criticism under 10 layers of phony praise. He was the only one who actually said something was bad outright, if someone gave a bad presentation. He attributed it to cultural difference. Guess it is rela…

[Americans] would sugar coat criticism under 10 layers of phony praise

It really annoys the hell out of me. What’s wrong with just saying what’s wrong?

The last example here on HN was a web version of flutter, where everyone was like “it’s amazing, so awesome, much controls” and only four comment levels deeper someone noted that it’s an utter crap that stutters at scroll on top hardware, cannot select text, cannot zoom, etc etc, so google reps had to start damage control.

And I wouldn’t even mind this positivity, if it didn’t put landmines in what you choose for daily use. Everything is so amazing and awesome, they love it, and when you try/buy it, it’s just a half-functioning crap that you have to finish yourself or wait until they do. As if these awesome’rs didn’t do anything beyond reading a tutorial. How can you relate positively to something that spent your days of learning and experimenting and in the end turned out to be a joke?

Re: Why Russians do not smile (2002)

#360

Post by bskrobisz »

dragonwriter wrote: post #298
dTal wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is no surprise that the English word is shorter, as - unlike English - Russian has two words for "why". "почему" asks - how did things come to be this way? "зачем" asks - what is the purpose of things being this way? Note the difference in implication if I ask you "why" you were late for work. "почему" allows room for circumstances beyond your control, while "зачем" places the blame squarely on your shoulders. Eng…

> Unlike English, Russian has two words for "why". English has at least three in the same space, two of which are in modern use. > "почему" asks - how did things come to be this way? In English, that's, unambiguously, “How". Which is kind of why your own translation starts with it. > "зачем" asks - what is the purpose of things being this way? In English that is, again unambiguously, though somewhat archaic, “wherefo…

Though I know very little Russian, I know enough to say that "how" and "pochemu" do not map 1:1 -- If I asked, in English, "how is this cardboard box flat?", the natural response would be "it's designed to be flattened" rather than "someone folded it down", but the natural response to "pochemu" would be the second. The full translation that was given would be necessary to disambiguate.
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