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Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

danfabulich.medium.com

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Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#351

Post by cbolton »

skinkestek wrote: post #167
IshKebab wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why they don't at least allow Google Takeout for banned accounts. They've already done all the hard work of implementing it!

Also takeout is kind of underwhelming: It was probably one of the last things Google announced that I was enthusiastic about: The rest here is my personal feeling. It might be wrong. I might have missed something. ... only when trying to use it it is dark patterns in layers to prevent you from actually using it: - getting links to download stuff takes more than enough time to get you to forget it. - and they only las…

They send an email when the link is ready though...

Also, you know have the option to have downloads prepared for you automatically at periodic intervals.

Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#352

Post by Zak »

sneak wrote: post #328
Zak wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to sell Android apps, you are. Yes, I know Android allows installs from sources other than Play Store, but if you want to be popular, you have to be in Play Store. I'm actually surprised/impressed with how successful that strategy has been for Google. I've always considered sideloading and alternate app stores to be an advantage for Android, but Google's store is effectively a monopoly anyway.

> If you want to sell Android apps, you are. No one is forced to sell Android apps, therefore, no one is forced to do business with Google.

Statements like this are technically correct, but not very useful to discussion of the problem of Google and other large corporations being in control of such large pieces of widely-used infrastructure that they effectively decide what kinds of things others will create.

Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#353

Post by zymhan »

chrisandchris wrote: post #62
bogwog wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stories like this always scare me because they remind me that all of my domain names are on Google domains, including the one I use for my work email address. I gotta migrate out one of these days.

Separating your DNS provider from your domain registry is always a good idea.

Highly agree.

I also prefer to host any actual services behind my domain on a third provider, but at the very least being able to redirect your domains is very helpful.

Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#354

Post by oneplane »

kps wrote: post #349
oneplane wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's likely not 'tech' but abusive customer interaction practises. Don't need tech for that, just an a-hole with an MBA.

When the only tool you have is an MBA, every customer looks like a nail.

If there was a screwdriver analogy, we could turn this in to: "If all you have is an MBA, every customer looks like it needs to be screwed".

All of this is of course fine banter, but there does seem to be a pattern where the end-of-the-chain responsible party just has some generic business related schooling that results in questionable practises in the name of profit, or in some cases just growth (or some derivative).

It's not the customer support agent that woke up one day and thought "how can I screw over the next customer I get on the line", it's probably not the engineer that made the software in such a way that it just screws over everyone who comes in contact with it. Middle management probably doesn't have much to do with it either; they are often just doing what their manager told them, and don't want to go against that and risk their position. They are often not responsible for the top-down policy either... so that leaves us with the people that feed a bad policy to the rest of the company.

Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#355

Post by wizzwizz4 »

Retric wrote: post #340
MomoXenosaga wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Computers don't think they just follow programming. The fault always lies at the humans who wrote the code. See HAL in 2010.

HAL was envisioned based on an early approach to AI. Modern AI techniques really don’t fit that model.

Modern AI techniques also don't really work as well as many think; they're awesome, but the hype far exceeds the reality. (For example, self-driving cars are very far away.) A HAL-like approach is actually better for most purposes I've encountered than “throw the problem at a deep neural net”.

Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#356

Post by jerf »

nawgz wrote: post #92
paxys wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I get what you are saying, this is sounding more and more like an abusive relationship. "Getting beaten by your husband? Try not being around him when he is drunk." At some point we have to face the reality that the tech ecosystem needs some serious fixing, for both consumers and developers.

Since when have we not looked at capitalist entities as abusers and exploiters? No one wants to be in this situation wrt megacorps and their stranglehold on the internet, free speech, and so many livelihoods. Putting the onus on consumers to fix this is hilarious and naive.

Look at it as a part of the portfolio of approaches we take to address this problem. It may not solve the problem on its own, but it's an important step to take. And arguably a necessary one; a great deal of what gives these companies so much power is that people simply can't imagine trying to do without them and don't even try.

Just because people say to stop giving them so much money and attention doesn't mean that they think that's the whole solution. But if you aren't making even a token effort to stop giving them so much money and attention, you're probably more part of the problem than the solution.

If you think these companies are a problem... take action. If you aren't willing to even so much as cancel a streaming subscription or take responsibility for backing up your own photos or whatever the issue is, you're sending major signals to the legislative system or whoever else it is you expect to swoop in and save you that you don't care enough for them to need to do anything either.

I don't mean this to be absolutist, either. I use Google in a few places, even despite my distrust and distaste of them. But even there, I hold them at arm's length. If they completely nuked my current accounts, it would mostly be an inconvenience. Worst bit would be the ~$20 of apps I'd have to repurchase. (I'd lose more than that but mostly I could just let them go.)

Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#357

Post by wizzwizz4 »

jannes wrote: post #285
andi999 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you have to name the account after a real or legal person?

I think you are looking for the term 'legal entity' instead of 'legal person'.

No, “legal person” (as opposed to “natural person”) is a real term.

Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#359

Post by atum47 »

Well, I know someone who wrote a bot to play his game and watch the ad at the end. This person made about 4 dollars in one or two nights letting the bot run. When pay day came, Google marked half of the revenue as invalid, and only paid 1,75 dollars.

This person knew the risks of being caught and let it go. My point is, I think Google warns you first about doing that.

Re: Google can ban your Android app if they think you’ve clicked on your own ads

#360

Post by lmkg »

kypro wrote: post #231
CGamesPlay wrote: post #7

I'd extend this even further: never use a single account for more than one purpose. Create a separate account at the same company for the other purpose. Some examples: - Every product/project you manage should be on a separate account on Google, Facebook, Amazon, etc. - Nothing tied to your consumer accounts should be used for anything business related. - Your Amazon shopping account and your AWS account should defin…

While this is good and practical advice, it does irritates me that there isn't more of a push for regulation to protect people against automated actions like this. I know in the EU we have protections under GDPR which allow us to request an explanation for an automated action, but I don't believe we have anyway to request human review. Part of the problem it seems is that even if these actions are unfair and unjustif…

> I know in the EU we have protections under GDPR which allow us to request an explanation for an automated action, but I don't believe we have anyway to request human review.

There is, with limitations. The relevant part of GDPR is Article 22, "Automated individual decision-making, including profiling" (Full text: https://gdpr-info.eu/art-22-gdpr/)

This is probably the most restricted of the rights granted under GDPR. You have the right to manual review of algorithmic decisions, only when those decisions result in "legal effects concerning him or her or similarly significantly affects him or her."

Whether it applies to Google depends on how you interpret "similarly significantly affects," and that's something likely to vary from country to country and well beyond my experience with GDPR. If this were the US, I would expect that to include housing and employment. There's a much stronger argument that this right applies to a Google account if it represents a significant fraction of your business income.

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