Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

helsinkibusinesshub.fi

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

351–360 of 632 posts

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#351

Post by cbmuser »

deanclatworthy wrote: post #257
rebuilder wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as language goes, my advice for learning a new one would be the exact opposite of what you say. Force yourself to use the language all the time, everywhere. Otherwise people will just default to English with you, and you'll have a hard time learning the local language. It'll be very stressful for a few months, but, in my experience, will get you conversing in about half a year.

As someone who has lived in this environment for this long, it doesn't work that way. This is not a language that shares any traits with English. It is hard to get going, and the vocabulary takes a considerable amount of time. You can't switch to Finnish at work, as you simply would not be able to get by, and you can't do it at home as it changes the dynamics of your relationship. This is not an excuse, it's reality.

I don’t buy that. Japanese is completely different, too, but I learned most of it while in Japan where I was forced to speak it.

Finish kids don’t need ten years to learn the language either, do they?

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#352

Post by adamsea »

ghufran_syed wrote: post #295
ponker wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are not ethnically Chinese you are an underclass in Singapore. If you are not black you are not an underclass in the United States. I have no idea what it is like to be black in Singapore but for anyone else, I would think "not being an underclass" is high on anyone's list.

Doesn't having a popular black president in the US from 2008-2016 rather undermine the idea that black people are an underclass in the US? As opposed to being a group that on average have lower income than other groups in society? Couldn't assuming that any individual black person has low income or is part of an "underclass" be considered racist, in the sense of making judgements about individuals based on their skin…

Are you living under a rock?

Sorry if I'm being rude, but ... seriously, I would be curious how much you know about U.S. history and current events. What's your context / are you a young person / do you not watch much news, or know much history?

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#353

Post by barrenko »

meekrohprocess wrote: post #291
outworlder wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would happily pay 3-5x the taxes for a similar salary to emigrate, but if you offer me 1/10 the pay? Are you calculating the cost of living?

Yes, it's mostly about purchasing power. Rent/property tax/insurance is expensive, but everything else is cheap and there's no VAT. Some states don't even have income taxes. We have insanely painful income inequality, but as shameful as it is, you can usually clear the hurdle prices with a 6-figure income. I'm not an aristocrat and I oscillate between working hard and going off into nature for random periods of time,…

It's mostly an mentality / personality thing. To some the European way of "things" are a bit insulting, others like having the corall / safety net. I'm in your camp.

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#354

Post by Laakeri »

meekrohprocess wrote: post #261
deanclatworthy wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can only speak for those in the web tech industry, but salaries go from 4-6k euros. Take-home pay would be in the region of 2.5-4.5k most likely. I've seen a lot of whining about the high taxes here, but honestly this is not a European way of thinking. You are safe here. You have a safety net if things don't go right in your work or health. Taxes are also super simple. You tell the tax office your predicted income,…

I am less concerned with the taxes, and more concerned that Amazon/Google/etc happily pay ten times that salary. It's literally an order of magnitude difference, and contracting hourly rates seems like a similar story. I would happily pay 3-5x the taxes for a similar salary to emigrate, but if you offer me 1/10 the pay? That's tough. It makes me feel like there isn't a big market for my services across the pond. It's…

Yeah, many people from Helsinki who are good enough to get a job at Amazon/Google/etc are actually moving abroad to work for them, so it doesn't make sense to move to Helsinki if you could get a job like that. Though there are some good cities in Europe with tech giants and their good pay, for example London and Zurich.

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#355

Post by timsally »

Teever wrote: post #279
timsally wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Frankly, it it not a coincidence that Silicon Valley and companies like SpaceX are in the US. They are direct results of the military ecosystem that has developed there. SpaceX is the direct result of a South African who studied in Canada and came to the US because that's what he wanted to do. The idea that the US "military ecosystem" could claim "direct" responsibility for what Elon has achieved is an insult to hi…

Why didn't Elon start SpaceX in Canada or South Africa?

> Why didn't Elon start SpaceX in Canada or South Africa?

Exactly my point. If you want to start a company as ambitious as SpaceX, the US is the only place to do it. If you do it somewhere else, you incur serious risk of getting a large chunk of the company seized/taxed, even if you are successful.

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#356

Post by Moru »

vianneychevalie wrote: post #333
bedobi wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Finland is very much Scandinavia, but that's a complete side note. The point is, it's absolutely not true that health care in Finland or the rest of Scandinavia is anywhere near as good as popularly imagined by Americans or even by many Scandinavians themselves. Anyone who moves to Scandinavia thinking the high taxes will give complete access to instant top notch treatment in case of cancer or many other conditions w…

Finland is not a part of Scandinavia [0]. It has linguistic, geographic, ethnic and historic differences. [0] https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/is-finland-part-of-scand...

It's a bit messier than that though. When spoken in English, Finland is often included in the term. However everyone here knows it's not realy. We instead use "Nordic countries" to include Finland and Greenland.

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#357

Post by [deleted] »

cbmuser wrote: post #351
deanclatworthy wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has lived in this environment for this long, it doesn't work that way. This is not a language that shares any traits with English. It is hard to get going, and the vocabulary takes a considerable amount of time. You can't switch to Finnish at work, as you simply would not be able to get by, and you can't do it at home as it changes the dynamics of your relationship. This is not an excuse, it's reality.

I don’t buy that. Japanese is completely different, too, but I learned most of it while in Japan where I was forced to speak it. Finish kids don’t need ten years to learn the language either, do they?

[deleted]

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#358

Post by timsally »

vulcan01 wrote: post #253
timsally wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Frankly, it it not a coincidence that Silicon Valley and companies like SpaceX are in the US. They are direct results of the military ecosystem that has developed there. SpaceX is the direct result of a South African who studied in Canada and came to the US because that's what he wanted to do. The idea that the US "military ecosystem" could claim "direct" responsibility for what Elon has achieved is an insult to hi…

I think the GP is trying to say that because of the military ecosystem in the US, it was easier for him to 1. find a large customer and 2. get r&d funding. Note that he says "They are direct results of the military ecosystem that has developed there." Why do you think Elon Musk chose to start SpaceX in the US?

> Why do you think Elon Musk chose to start SpaceX in the US?

Should we ask the founder in South Africa who was able to recruit the right technical talent and hold a majority share of a private rocket/satellite company while remaining in South Africa?

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#359

Post by refurb »

tclancy wrote: post #196
refurb wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You work in Silicon Valley, have good insurance and you’re worried about medical bankruptcy? I was in the same shoes as you and had zero concerns about it (yes I realized that a very lucky position to be in). Even if I had something horrible happen my max out of pocket was like $4k for the year with no limit to coverage. If I lost my job, had zero income and no insurance I’d qualify for Medi-cal.

How did it go when you had a really serious medical situation? My eye opener was my first programming job when one of the owners had twins with really serious health problems at birth. Turned out a million dollars was the cap the insurance was willing to cough up for them.

No more lifetime caps.

Re: Helsinki Relocation Package: City as a Service

#360

Post by doikor »

bedobi wrote: post #288
antris wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can you pay for private dentists, or similar, if you need more immediate service If you need immediate service, you get to a fast track queue and can get free dentist care on the same day. If it's non-acute, you can go to a private clinic which is highly subsidized but does costs some money. But nothing like in the US. > And is the wait similar for major things like cancer, brain tutor, or heart surgery If you have…

No offense but OP is right and you are wrong. Health care in Scandinavia is great in many ways and not so great in others. People do suffer, even die, waiting in line for public treatment, and health care lawsuits aren't really a thing.

> People do suffer, even die, waiting in line for public treatment

Never heard of anyone dying waiting for public treatment here in Finland. If you have some life threatening issue you will get treatment right away.

I would say the only one coming anywhere close to that here is the somewhat bad access to mental healthcare that can end up in suicide if left untreated. But based on the amount of homeless people with severe mental illness on the streets of America I don't think things are better there (though beating USA in health care is a really low bar)

Yes if you have some non-urgent problem you might have to wait a few months in the public health care (if you have the money/insurance you can go to the private sector)

Post reply on HN