Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

For suicide prevention, try raising the minimum wage, research suggests

npr.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

351–355 of 355 posts

Re: For suicide prevention, try raising the minimum wage, research suggests

#351

Post by luckydata »

corporate_shi11 wrote: post #211
luckydata wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because if you're told you're supposed to "make it" since birth, and you don't, you feel like a piece of shit. Marginalized communities have been told the other story, every little thing is a win. Difference in expectations is huge, and source of all sort of bad things (like racial resentment etc...). Solution: make this country slightly less "dog eat dog" and you'll solve a LOT of social issues almost overnight.

Using the term "marginalized communities" as a broad descriptor for people with a certain skin color in America is misguided and counterproductive. It paints a distorted view of reality and is a political statement more than anything else.

being poor and uneducated in this country IS being marginalized. I clearly stated that if you're white the expectations are different, but whatever else you're reading in my message is your projection.

Re: For suicide prevention, try raising the minimum wage, research suggests

#352

Post by solinent »

ctdonath wrote: post #327
14 wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hope we do not get a UBI in any current forms. I know the second the stores realize that every person now has 'x' amount of dollars to spend, they will raise the prices to match the most they can extract. What I wish Canada would do instead is establish some sort of Universal Basic Rights like every man woman and child is entitled to 5lbs of potatoes a week, 1 gallon of milk, 1 pound of carrots, ect. I as a…

Glad someone noticed. If everyone is getting $1000/month, that becomes the new $0/month. Basic necessities, especially rent, will jump in cost; a low-end landlord will know everyone there has another $1000/month to spend, as does everyone looking for an apartment, so rent will jump because if one renter doesn't want to pay more there will be someone else who can. Of course economic complexities will affect this, but…

$1000/mo buys (some) food, $0 does not

Re: For suicide prevention, try raising the minimum wage, research suggests

#353

Post by solinent »

celdon25 wrote: post #344
anm89 wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We already have soup kitchens in America. We have solutions of last resort regarding hunger. So this is a total strawman. Yes. Having every man, woman and child line up for government potatoes, government bread, and government cheese at some government office is unequivocally a dystopian nightmare.

Saying that "every man, woman and child" would be lining up is a straw man also. "Every man, woman and child" does not currently line up at soup kitchens. There's also no reason that distribution has to work that way. How about an EBT card mailed to every home, which can be used for potatoes, cheese, and bread at any grocery store?

> Saying that "every man, woman and child" would be lining up is a straw man also. "Every man, woman and child" does not currently line up at soup kitchens.

It's also a strawman because not everyone would be lining up for potatoes in this instance, presumably some people can afford to eat in this free suds world. Maybe we'll even have a post-potato society eventually, when everyone decides they hate potatoes after they all get jobs (probably not).

Re: For suicide prevention, try raising the minimum wage, research suggests

#354

Post by ctdonath »

solinent wrote: post #352
ctdonath wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Glad someone noticed. If everyone is getting $1000/month, that becomes the new $0/month. Basic necessities, especially rent, will jump in cost; a low-end landlord will know everyone there has another $1000/month to spend, as does everyone looking for an apartment, so rent will jump because if one renter doesn't want to pay more there will be someone else who can. Of course economic complexities will affect this, but…

$1000/mo buys (some) food, $0 does not

You won't have $1000/mo for food when your landlord raises rent by $1000/mo.

As I said, the actual economics around this are more complicated, but the paraphrase/summary is that if nobody has to work for $1000/mo and everybody gets $1000/mo then $1000/mo will be worth practically nothing, with staples & necessities rising to consume that.

If we exclude rent from consideration, and apply the economics of UBI to just food: the average price of 1 Calorie (of which you need ~2000/day) rises $0.016, or $32/day. For a baseline reference, I regularly make healthy meals at $1/plate. Congrats, you've just increased the cost of food to at least $35 per day - precisely because "everyone now has $1000/month, free".

If we then roughly combine that with housing (as primary costs): I figure a normal baseline poverty minimum of $10/day for living space & utilities plus $3/day food, but then you're adding $32/day available which those necessities will instantly absorb (supply-and-demand) ... ergo you've just increased poverty-level living costs by 3.5x!

Unintended consequence: giving everyone $1000/month increases the cost of a $1 hamburger to $3.50. Now the beggar with $0 has to find/panhandle close to four times as much to afford something barely considered a complete meal. This is not what you had in mind.

Re: For suicide prevention, try raising the minimum wage, research suggests

#355

Post by solinent »

ctdonath wrote: post #354
solinent wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$1000/mo buys (some) food, $0 does not

You won't have $1000/mo for food when your landlord raises rent by $1000/mo. As I said, the actual economics around this are more complicated, but the paraphrase/summary is that if nobody has to work for $1000/mo and everybody gets $1000/mo then $1000/mo will be worth practically nothing, with staples & necessities rising to consume that. If we exclude rent from consideration, and apply the economics of UBI to just f…

> You won't have $1000/mo for food when your landlord raises rent by $1000/mo.

You would if you're homeless and can't pay the rent because you need food to survive.

Post reply on HN