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Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

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Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#351

Post by icebraining »

navigatesol wrote: post #315
the_duke wrote: post #290

I'd argue that credit cards are conceptually not very different. Users pay the fees both directly (annual costs, interest) and indirectly (increased prices due to vendor fees), and the shareholders reap the benefits. Just like credit cards, and the various digital currencies like Bitcoin (where exchanges have plenty of regulation and reporting requirements to deal with!), this will be subject to regulation and govern…

> Users pay the fees both directly (annual costs, interest) Both avoidable. Many zero fee cards, interest only on monthly balances. Some zero fee cards even offer rewards (read: net positive over cash). > indirectly (increased prices due to vendor fees) I'd need to see some data that the convenience of credit cards to both consumer and retailer has increased prices. I do know that explicitly raising prices to cover f…

> I do know that explicitly raising prices to cover fees for card using customers is against most merchant account terms of service and you can report retailers that do so.

That's no longer the case after Visa, Mastercard, etc were sued[1] and reached a settlement in 2013 disallowing those terms. A few states have passed laws to reimpose that rule, but most haven't, afaik.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_Card_Interchange_Fee_a...

Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#352

Post by hesk »

So, the Guardian article says that it uses blockchain but is invite-only at the moment. But if it's not public, why do you need blockchain? So is it blockchain as in Bitcoin (i.e., proof of work) or "blockchain" as in hype? I hope it's not the former because proof of work wastes so much energy it's not even funny.

Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#353

Post by plesner »

viscanti wrote: post #287
yumraj wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is even more terrifying is that this is being done by Facebook which has a person like Mark Zuckerberg, who has again and again shown that he has no moral compass and has complete disregard for people privacy rights and by extension other rights, as its dictator, with no real board oversight due to how stocks are structured.

> this is being done by Facebook which has a person like Mark Zuckerberg, who has again and again shown that he has no moral compass and has complete disregard for people privacy rights Sure. But think about all the money they can make from selling ads if they know everything that people buy. Doesn't he have a fiduciary responsibility to maximize shareholder value?

No he doesn't, that is not what fiduciary responsibility means. See https://corpgov.law.harvard.edu/2012/06/26/the-shareholder-v...

Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#354

Post by UncleEntity »

mathnmusic wrote: post #308
_bxg1 wrote: post #200

Terrifying, really. The world is hurdling back towards a feudalist society, with corporations instead of kings.

Shouldn't Facebook be focusing on their previous project that promised to "connect the unconnected" (Internet.org / FreeBasics), rather than start another ambitious one "to bank the unbanked" ?

Methinks they can do more than one thing at a time, get everyone on the internets and facebanked using separate teams within the organization.

Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#355

Post by tommoor »

renaudg wrote: post #260
moosey wrote: post #233

If this succeeds, it will be a data collection tool the likes of which the world has never seen, which is why so many companies are willing to put their name on it. The data, along with ML/AI, and our contemporary understanding of the human mind, means that this is a major step towards control that we can't understand. Dr. Harari explains it better than I do in "21 Lessons for the 21st Century", but this tool is part…

There is at least this from Zuckerberg's announcement : "Calibra will be regulated like other payment service providers. Any information you share with Calibra will be kept separate from information you share on Facebook."

separate doesn't mean they can't be linked.

Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#356

Post by kodz4 »

mathnmusic wrote: post #308
_bxg1 wrote: post #200

Terrifying, really. The world is hurdling back towards a feudalist society, with corporations instead of kings.

Shouldn't Facebook be focusing on their previous project that promised to "connect the unconnected" (Internet.org / FreeBasics), rather than start another ambitious one "to bank the unbanked" ?

There are lot of people connecting to the unbanked via facebook/whatsapp/insta and transacting with them financially off the network.

When you have 1 network connecting 2 billion people why get off the network onto some other network to do a transaction. If I want to send cash to a family member in the developing world it's more convenient if the pay button is right there in the messaging app.

As to privacy and Zuckerberg controlling everything, well the banks and telcos already have all my data and keep spamming me day and night based on that data.

Whether the data gets centralized and the number of networks reduce to 1 is less interesting to me, than whether they use the data collected to take advantage of me. We do have road networks where you can drive from one end of the world to another without worrying about who the road owner is and how they might take advantage of you.

Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#358

Post by fauigerzigerk »

I wonder how they plan to keep the price of the Libra stable.

I understand that by keeping fiat currency reserves, they can guarantee a minimum exchange rate below which the Libra can never fall.

But how can they stop the Libra from rising? And once it has risen, how can they stop it from crashing back down to the guaranteed exchange rate?

Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#359

Post by aiiane »

InTheArena wrote: post #197

Certain activist groups put constant pressure on Facebook to “deplatform” and remove pages for both legitimate in it legitimate reasons. Now we’re talking about giving Facebook control over the very means to do financial transactions. How long Before this also becomes weapononized, by Facebook, or by activists? there is a reason why popular currency systems has been the purview of governments. We’re creating an awful…

Visa and MasterCard already cut off services to some groups.

Re: Facebook reveals its cryptocurrency Libra

#360

Post by umadon »

baby wrote: post #121
imw wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot of interesting physics in building thermonuclear weapons. Doesn't mean you should do it. Your talents could be used to help the world. Instead, they are being used to enclose common spaces and pull apart the fabric of society. Get a better job?

I appreciate your point of view, FWIW I believe that I'm doing net positive work for the world. If you don't believe such projects should exist, you can at least agree that such project will inevitably happen and that it is a good thing that they have people like me onboard to influence them in the right direction. I will write more about the things I work on and why I think these are good things on my blog www.crypt…

"I appreciate your point of view, FWIW I believe that I'm doing net positive work for the world."

Well, you're wrong. You believe this because you're getting paid a lot of money to.

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