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Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

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Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#351

Post by 0x445442 »

biztos wrote: post #193

All my experience shopping at grocery chains in the US and elsewhere has impressed upon me that these workers represent the absolute classic, textbook case for unionization. Yes, including Whole Paycheck[0] as well as Trader Joe's and Safeway and Von's and everybody else. While I can imagine Amazon having a loathing of unions, if they really want to be in this space they will sooner or later have to contend with the…

>> the US is going to become once again more union-friendly in the coming years.

It sometimes surprises people that, as a Libertarian, I applaud workers attempts to unionize. It's really the only way for those who just want to put in an honest days work to combat continually living under a cloud of worry their job/benefits will not be taken from them and given to those with equal skills but who are more desperate to survive.

In a truly free market, individual workers should be allowed and, in some cases, encouraged to organized.

Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#352

Post by pjc50 »

frockington wrote: post #326
alkonaut wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking from the perspective of working unions (Scandinavia) what makes unions work and be relevant are the protections they enjoy. The unions fought for these protections. Without being able to unionize you can't improve your position as a union either. You have to start somewhere. So: first: employers can't choose (freely) who to lay off. It's first in last out, or if you want to sidestep that, you'll have to comp…

Does Scandanavia suffer from the same stigma as French companies? In the States, working with anyone in France is absolutely terrible because its near impossible to fire anyone and they never work due to labor laws. Do you think Scandanavia still encourages productivity enough? The problem of having workers rights and encouraging productivity seems a fine line to walk

People keep saying things like this, while France remains a technologically advanced society with nuclear powered 200mph trains, chip fabs, aerospace industries etc. Nominal GDP per capita has just overtaken the UK. It's not clear that it produces less work, just less presence in the office.

Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#353

Post by perl4ever »

Timmah wrote: post #241
perl4ever wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone's going to make me uncomfortable, I'd stop going there. But if I really still wanted to go there, I'd work on a spiel about the charities I like and when they ask me to donate, I'd ask them to donate.

You're only making it harder on the wage slave behind the check stand. Theyre required to ask.

I wasn't suggesting I would pick a random charity just to be vindictive.

Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#354

Post by coldtea »

lordlimecat wrote: post #333
coldtea wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I recognize that your comment is dripping of cynicism so I'm not entirely sure which parts are true. You're saying that you can't get maternity leave at Whole Foods (or in the entire USA maybe? Generally not, unless if you're some hot shit or in a well unionized job. Heck, in tons of jobs people are lucky to get their toiler breaks... > I don't know whether this is national or just that Whole Foods is somehow a hor…

You should either clarify that you are talking about unpaid leave, or you should read your own articles. Maternity leave is guaranteed for most employees under FMLA. >They can find 100 ways to fire you in ways that don't break the letter of the law if you ask for something the law supposedly guarantees. That can be actionable too. If you are pregnant and they fire you, they are opening themselves up to so much liabil…

>Maternity leave is guaranteed for most employees under FMLA.

You'd be surprised.

The FMLA only mandates for unpaid leave. That's unlike most western european countries. And even that's under BS conditions and subject to employer power plays as opposed to totally normal and acceptable (and paid).

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2008/06/what-family-lea...

https://newfoodeconomy.org/giving-kitchen-staplehouse/

https://www.motherjones.com/media/2017/05/working-mothers-mo...

>That can be actionable too. If you are pregnant and they fire you, they are opening themselves up to so much liability it outweighs the few dollars they might save.

Maternity leave is not just for pregmant people. What about after birth?

Besides, there are lots of ways to make it so it's not actionable.

Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#355

Post by ardy42 »

ardy42 wrote: post #240
imagiko wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haven't you been pushed about getting an REI membership? I think twice before asking any REI salesman for help, because I know they are going to push me to get a membership. They're doing their job since their incentives are tied to memberships to some degree, but it makes for a poor experience. /edit:I'd rather be asked about a membership once at the cashier's than by every sales staff I talk to during my visit.

> Haven't you been pushed about getting an REI membership? I think twice before asking any REI salesman for help, because I know they are going to push me to get a membership. Do you realize that REI is a co-op [1] and the membership will entitle you to cash back on your purchases and a vote for their board of directors? It's a one-time fee, and mine paid for itself the first year I had it. It's a stupid grocery stor…

> It's a stupid grocery store loyalty card.

TYPO DETECTED: I just realized I meant to say it's not a stupid grocery store loyalty card, it's way better for the customer.

Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#356

Post by krapp »

noer wrote: post #347
xg15 wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Employers are not and should not be required to pay you for work you are not doing. Most other developed countries seem to see that slightly differently. But ok, it is a stance you can discuss - however, it becomes enormously cynical when combined with the conservative aversion against welfare rights: So you're pregnant or sick and happen to not have enough resources to live from savings for a few months. If neithe…

> it's important to negotiate it when arranging employment I'm going to guess that a very small portion of WFMs employees have the ability to successfully negotiate their employment terms

>I'm going to guess that a very small portion of WFMs employees have the ability to successfully negotiate their employment terms

A very small portion of all employees have that ability, much less an opportunity to attempt to negotiate the terms of their employment. I think a lot of people here overestimate the leverage that the average employee - including tech industry employees - actually have with their employers.

Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#358

Post by ceejayoz »

Timmah wrote: post #248
nickthemagicman wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I quit donating to charity after I found out that Red Cross only gives a small fraction of its donations to charity the rest is spent on Administration costs. Just like colleges and the healthcare industry. Got to pay all those vp's of vp's of vp's.

It's not a "small fraction". You're probably confused with Susan Komen. Red Cross has it's faults, but if they can serve more victims by hiring more effective people with 6 figure salaries, aren't they doing more good? By analogy, the main rocket on the space shuttle has two stages of fuel pumps...powered by rocket fuel. So you could say that's inefficient, why not run fuel straight from the tanks into the rocket. Bu…

There are very significant issues with the Red Cross and how it spends money. For example: https://www.npr.org/2015/06/03/411524156/in-search-of-the-re...

> NPR and ProPublica went in search of the nearly $500 million and found a string of poorly managed projects, questionable spending and dubious claims of success, according to a review of hundreds of pages of the charity's internal documents and emails, as well as interviews with a dozen current and former officials.

> The Red Cross says it has provided homes to more than 130,000 people, but the number of permanent homes the charity has built is six.

By all means, donate to a deserving charity. The RC probably isn't one.

Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#359

Post by Timmah »

ceejayoz wrote: post #358
Timmah wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a "small fraction". You're probably confused with Susan Komen. Red Cross has it's faults, but if they can serve more victims by hiring more effective people with 6 figure salaries, aren't they doing more good? By analogy, the main rocket on the space shuttle has two stages of fuel pumps...powered by rocket fuel. So you could say that's inefficient, why not run fuel straight from the tanks into the rocket. Bu…

There are very significant issues with the Red Cross and how it spends money. For example: https://www.npr.org/2015/06/03/411524156/in-search-of-the-re... > NPR and ProPublica went in search of the nearly $500 million and found a string of poorly managed projects, questionable spending and dubious claims of success, according to a review of hundreds of pages of the charity's internal documents and emails, as well as…

I remember that story when it broke. But I thought there was a good reason why they didn't build houses. I can't remember, but it was something like the people didn't own the land they lived on, so building would have been giving the land owner a free house, not a hurricane victim. Or else armed thugs would steal any structure built.

Re: Whole Foods workers seek to unionize

#360

Post by [deleted] »

pxlpshr wrote: post #184

A lot of finger pointing at Amazon but most of the employment demands from the 'union' have been characteristics of Whole Foods since looonnngg before the aquisition. For example, unpaid paternity/maternity leave, no recognition of any holiday including federal - just 3 weeks of PTO used at your discretion, below market compensation, crappy benefits, calcified management, and the list goes on. Most people work there…

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