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Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

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Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#351

Post by paulddraper »

efng wrote: post #307
paulddraper wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. US home ownership has gone up and down between 64% and 69% in the past 30 years, currently at the low end of that. But at the same time, the average new house went from 1,600 to 2,500 sqft. Thirty years ago, how many people plopped down $5k for a TV? $700 for a phone? $150/month for telecom? Life expediency has increased by 6 years from 1975 to 2010. And to top it off, we're working less than we ever have. Aver…

> And to top it off, we're working less than we ever have This really struck me. I am going to assume your numbers ar correct, but if you could point me to a source I would love that. (did a quick search on the web, couldn't find exactly what I would like) My first thought was that it is fascinating that we would be working 12% less hours per person. I wonder how that break down by gender. The number I keep finding i…

> if you could point me to a source I would love that

Data from FRED. Graphs: http://www.businessinsider.com/average-annual-hours-worked-f...

You're correct that more people working per household is a likely cause of less hour per employee, larger houses, etc.

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#352

Post by mtanski »

mistermann wrote: post #286
mtanski wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A older friend of mine who structured financial products said that the worst thing we did for the healt of the Social Secuirty fund was the war on cigarettes. He said it in jest... but he wasn't wrong.

Oh, I'd love to hear more detail on this if you remember any?

If I remember correctly he was structuring a derivative contract based on life expectancy/actual life time. The goal was to hedge risks between health insurers and life insurance policies.

Life insurance policies policies want to offset the risk of a group dying prematurely in the defined time window and health insurance companies want to offset risk a group of people living long but with signifiant health problems.

At the time it didn't go anywhere because some folks dubbed it "Death Derivatives" and he was working on it at the mortgage crisis was unfolding.

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#353

Post by ionised »

humanrebar wrote: post #335
somecallitblues wrote: post #321

How can they earn more when all the money is at the hands of Trump and others who make up 1%? The current capitalism is not distributing the wealth very well and it's certainly nearing a disaster. I wish the left had an answer but they don't. They're stuck with political correctness and more extreme are can't see that they don't have an answer to capitalism and that everything they've tried in the past has failed, an…

> I wish the left had an answer but they don't. The left is the 1% as well. How much money do the Clintons have? A lot. How much Wall Street support did Obama have? A lot. If Hollywood isn't the 1%, what are they? > ...working class have found a billionaire to be their champion... Thiel is interesting partly because he's a business leader that talks about politics and isn't explicitly liberal. That is, he's an except…

The problem is the political landscape has lurched so far to the right that we've hit a point where some people actually consider Obama and Clinton to be 'left'.

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#354

Post by toomuchtodo »

mistermann wrote: post #349
Chinjut wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I may be reading too much into what you are getting at with your second question, but: What does it even mean to draw that distinction in this context? Our current state is already a forceful one (as would be any other distribution of claims with any real power of enforcement). Wealth, like anything else, is ultimately enforced by, er, force. (E.g.: What is it for you to own land? It's the ability to have me forceful…

The people having their money removed from them may have a word or two to say about the plan.

There is a cost for being allowed to collect wealth in society. Lots of countries to pick from if someone decides to leave.

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#355

Post by maxerickson »

paulddraper wrote: post #288
outericky wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sense of entitlement is a lot higher these days. I grew up in a 900 sqft house with 1 bathroom. Yet all my peers (myself included) seek out homes 2x, 3x or bigger. Same with cars.... my parents bought used, reliable cars. Today we want fancy things. Growing up we had cable tv and a phone line. Probably spent $50/month total. The family cellphone bill, home broadband, various tv services easily top out over $300/m…

This. US home ownership has gone up and down between 64% and 69% in the past 30 years, currently at the low end of that. But at the same time, the average new house went from 1,600 to 2,500 sqft. Thirty years ago, how many people plopped down $5k for a TV? $700 for a phone? $150/month for telecom? Life expediency has increased by 6 years from 1975 to 2010. And to top it off, we're working less than we ever have. Aver…

Televisions themselves have come way (way!) down in price.

Bigger, better televisions cost 1/2 as much before accounting for inflation.

There was certainly a brief period where medium sized flat screens were a little bit pricey.

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#356

Post by warkdarrior »

tcoppi wrote: post #53
CodeCube wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This feels correct, anecdotally ... but is there data to support this claim? For example, savings rates going down, credit/debt going up, and consumer spending going down?

Here's savings rate data: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PSAVERT Note that this is savings rate net of taxes. It has been on a mostly steady decline since it has been calculated, with some spikes and a leveling out slightly higher than the rate before the last recession.

What happened from December 2012 to January 2013 for the personal savings rate to drop from 11% to 5%?

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#357

Post by eli_gottlieb »

somecallitblues wrote: post #321

How can they earn more when all the money is at the hands of Trump and others who make up 1%? The current capitalism is not distributing the wealth very well and it's certainly nearing a disaster. I wish the left had an answer but they don't. They're stuck with political correctness and more extreme are can't see that they don't have an answer to capitalism and that everything they've tried in the past has failed, an…

>I wish the left had an answer but they don't. They're stuck with political correctness and more extreme are can't see that they don't have an answer to capitalism and that everything they've tried in the past has failed

Were you paying attention to a guy called Bernie Sanders? He was the first actual leftist to run for high office in the USA in generations.

Clinton was a wishy-washy centrist who could barely even pretend to be throwing scraps to the Sanders movement.

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#358

Post by eli_gottlieb »

vibrato wrote: post #109
djedipus wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is based on a history of recessions. Unfortunately this one is different (really)... We've never had interest rates so low for so long. It's possible, and I consider it likely, that those younger will be even more affected. Consider the possibility that parents run out of money and living in the basement isn't even an option. Also consider there is a decent chance for another recession before this one is even ov…

The last recession ended in 2009.

Wages did not start growing until 2015, and that required social movements in the streets demanding $15/hour and a union.

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#359

Post by humanrebar »

ionised wrote: post #353
humanrebar wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wish the left had an answer but they don't. The left is the 1% as well. How much money do the Clintons have? A lot. How much Wall Street support did Obama have? A lot. If Hollywood isn't the 1%, what are they? > ...working class have found a billionaire to be their champion... Thiel is interesting partly because he's a business leader that talks about politics and isn't explicitly liberal. That is, he's an except…

The problem is the political landscape has lurched so far to the right that we've hit a point where some people actually consider Obama and Clinton to be 'left'.

Nationalized healthcare has always been on the left in America.

And I'd argue that Trump has much more in common with progressive-era Democrats (like Wilson) than he does with "the right" in modern America.

If this isn't the election where we throw away (or at least officially redefine) the concept of "left" and "right", I'm not sure there will be one.

Re: Barely Half of 30-Year-Olds in the U.S. Earn More Than Their Parents Did at 30

#360

Post by JDiculous »

retube wrote: post #345
pikzen wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So far automation has not resulted in net fewer jobs Yes. Yes it has. Manufacturing has seen hundred of thousands of jobs replaced. And the amount of software developers or maintenance jobs created to make that work doesn't even begin to cover what has been lost. As far as job creation goes, guess you'll have to check that up with the ever growing percentage of unemployment throughout first world countries.

yes there's less manufacturing jobs. There's also less farming jobs, and less clerical jobs, and fewer blacksmiths, cobblers, seamstresses and about a 1,000 other professions too. But the developed world is at near full employment.

Full employment is a meaningless metric. If 90% of the workforce is working meaningless minimum wage jobs and barely making ends meet, the economy is at "full employment", but that doesn't mean we're doing well. Full unemployment also doesn't take into account the labor participation rate, which has been on a downward trend.
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