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Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

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Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#341

Post by throwup238 »

brailsafe wrote: post #164
NamTaf wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> This is a prime example of why programmers are not seriously considered engineers. Seems to me like your comment is simply an example of prejudice. You're just describing another standardized incentive structure that you're operating in, and using that as a basis to extrapolate that programmers of all kinds—whether they work on a video platform or on machinery that could cause catastrophe if it fails—are implicitly…

> You're just describing another standardized incentive structure that you're operating in

Yeah, that’s the point. That incentive structure includes going to prison, and employers aren’t willing to die on that hill because it exposes them to insane liability if they go against a certified Professional Engineer.

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#342

Post by ses1984 »

rippeltippel wrote: post #340
NamTaf wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

In the country where I live there are two university degrees: Computer Science (depends on Mathematics) and Information Engineering (depends on Engineering). I took the latter, where there is more maths (despite not depending from the Maths department), physics, electronic, automation. I now work with healthcare data: a highly regulated field. Can you please explain what is _not_ engineering, given this context?

No one is saying all programmers lack engineering discipline. It is simply not required for all programmers, even in many situations when it probably should be.

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#343

Post by g-b-r »

rippeltippel wrote: post #340
NamTaf wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

In the country where I live there are two university degrees: Computer Science (depends on Mathematics) and Information Engineering (depends on Engineering). I took the latter, where there is more maths (despite not depending from the Maths department), physics, electronic, automation. I now work with healthcare data: a highly regulated field. Can you please explain what is _not_ engineering, given this context?

You're certain that there's more math in the information engineering degree than in the CS one? It's usually the opposite

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#344

Post by [deleted] »

rippeltippel wrote: post #340
NamTaf wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

In the country where I live there are two university degrees: Computer Science (depends on Mathematics) and Information Engineering (depends on Engineering). I took the latter, where there is more maths (despite not depending from the Maths department), physics, electronic, automation. I now work with healthcare data: a highly regulated field. Can you please explain what is _not_ engineering, given this context?

[deleted]

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#345

Post by UqWBcuFx6NV4r »

brailsafe wrote: post #164
NamTaf wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> This is a prime example of why programmers are not seriously considered engineers. Seems to me like your comment is simply an example of prejudice. You're just describing another standardized incentive structure that you're operating in, and using that as a basis to extrapolate that programmers of all kinds—whether they work on a video platform or on machinery that could cause catastrophe if it fails—are implicitly…

The prevalence of calling software development “engineering” was 100% a con job by either self-important nerds or the companies pandering to them in tight job markets.

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#346

Post by numpad0 »

term333 wrote: post #209
Root_Denied wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>my engineering licence would be revoked and I would be kicked out of the industry. This isn't because you're a "real" engineer, it's because of regulation and industry licensing around specific engineering disciplines that didn't exist until the start of the 20th century. Railroad engineers in the 1800's didn't have the same set of regulations to follow, or the same liability for mistakes. Software engineering could…

I think the general hacker culture of most programmers prevents this. There's an undercurrent of anti-establishment, anti-authority, anti-management, etc... To think that the industry might choose to self enforce a license system seems very unlikely.

I think another reason this hasn't happened is sheer complexity of the modern software stack. No one fully understand how everything works, in principle or in details. You can't certify someone or establish principles for things no one understands anything about.

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#347

Post by lordie »

Mg6yDfjp5U wrote: post #10

I recently left Google having worked on a number of projects with various YouTube teams. I think I can explain why it's being handled this way by YouTube. This is a fairly nuanced/involved issue, so the task of classifying the bug likely made it's way to one of the engineers responsible for the implementation of this feature. That engineer has already launched this project, and filed it away under their GRAD (perform…

It's easy to cynically generalize and attribute to the broken promo process when it is more likely either a non-engineer reviewing the report or someone else not really understanding the nuances of prompt injection. I work at YouTube, and I've escalated it to the appropriate TLs and TnS leads to take a look.

Bugs in existing projects and a sense of ownership and leadership are absolutely a part of GRAD, having been in several calibrations and promo committees myself. So while this understanding has a grain of truth, it is far from what's evaluated, at least in my VP's org. I can't speak to Cloud or any other PAs.

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#348

Post by g-b-r »

mattalex wrote: post #122
wrs wrote: post #5

>Comments should be passed to the model with clear role boundaries that prevent them from being interpreted as system-level directives. Well, such clear boundaries would solve lots of problems. But those don’t exist, do they?

You can get rid of 99.9% of those attacks by simply dispatching the data consumption to a different instance of the LLM, see, for instance, some of the later patterns in https://arxiv.org/abs/2506.08837

How would they apply to this case?

They require being able to transorm the output to something symbolic, but this YouTube feature necessarily has to output free-form text, derived directly from the comments..!

What would actually prevent the "attack" is for YouTube to not turn markdown from random LLM outputs into actual links.

In general, those patterns seem applicable only to a limited amount of cases, I think that they prevent much less than 99.9% of the attacks.

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#349

Post by consp »

NamTaf wrote: post #149
Mg6yDfjp5U wrote: post #10

I recently left Google having worked on a number of projects with various YouTube teams. I think I can explain why it's being handled this way by YouTube. This is a fairly nuanced/involved issue, so the task of classifying the bug likely made it's way to one of the engineers responsible for the implementation of this feature. That engineer has already launched this project, and filed it away under their GRAD (perform…

[flagged]

I am pretty sure my job would be on the line if I neglected to report a security issue. It is Google's incentives which are not aligned.

Re: Leaking YouTube creators' private videos

#350

Post by miki123211 »

NamTaf wrote: post #149
Mg6yDfjp5U wrote: post #10

I recently left Google having worked on a number of projects with various YouTube teams. I think I can explain why it's being handled this way by YouTube. This is a fairly nuanced/involved issue, so the task of classifying the bug likely made it's way to one of the engineers responsible for the implementation of this feature. That engineer has already launched this project, and filed it away under their GRAD (perform…

[flagged]

Software engineers have a widely-shared belief that most software issues are far less severe than those found in civil engineering. Even a security breach — arguably the worst issue there is — rarely results in any meaningful consequences for those whose data has been breached.

I don't think this belief is entirely justified, but as programmers, it's really hard to predict when our actions suddenly become life-threatening, so the belief persists.

My college ethics professor told us a story where a few people died at some concert somewhere in South America, because a software developer at a data analytics company pushed a config change that made all apps with their SDK crash on launch, and that included the ticket app needed to get into the concert venue. The mob, when learning that they wouldn't be seeing their favorite artists due to a software bug, got very agitated and trampled a few people to death.

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