341–350 of 520 posts
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Why possess the card when you can just buy the UUID on the dark web
sure? i feel like i need to reemphasize the "not going for 100% effectiveness" thing again. hopefully some parent steps in if their kid is on the dark web trying to make purchases with their parent's credit card.
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Gating is not just for porn, they are talking about using for social media and various other things. You can imagine that many things end up age gated if this becomes legislation, as a preventative measure. Then your 10% becomes problematic because you are either restricting or granting access based on invalid information. So in your world here we then need ways for people who were incorrectly gated to reach out and…
You're mixing up false positives and false negatives. Nobody is going to be incorrectly blocked under this system unless they lost their ID, and the fix there is getting a new ID. Some kids skipping the block sometimes isn't catastrophic, especially because there won't be all this peer pressure to join adult social media when 90% or more are blocked.
I'm not sure how you confidently can say that every company is going to allow the people we can't verify have access?
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Some undoubtedly will. Installing a new browser is already a bit hard for most people. I think you are a little skewed in your thinking being online on HN. You also aren't thinking about age. Certainly 16 and 18 year old probably can get a new browser installed. But a 14 year old? 12 year old? 10 year old? That barrier is a lot higher the younger a kid is.
I just finished my second year as a fifth grade teacher, so I have a lot of experience with ten year olds. I am confident a majority of my students would be able to install an alternative web browser if they needed to, and a majority of the remainder would ask a friend to do it. To give you an example of the workarounds kids will find: Youtube was blocked on school laptops, so the kids all started embedding Youtube v…
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Don't even bother having the website ask the browser anything at all. Just have the website TELL the browser the content is intended for adults via HTTP header and let the browser decide to display it or not depending on parental controls.
Yeah, that's even better.
The RTA one was even pushed by the porn industry and is already in place in majors websites[3]
[2]:https://icra.org/webmasters/
[3]:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Sites_Advocatin...
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And honestly, all these should ultimately just be done client side in the browser. After the browser has verified "User is x or user is over 21" there's no reason to then send that information to the website. Let websites issue a "window.isUserOver(16)" call once and then move forward based on the response to that query.
This would require browser attestation, wouldn't it? Otherwise kids are just going to download a custom build of Chromium where `window.isUserOver(16)` is always `True`.
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> In practice this means no rooted/jailbroken phones. Personally - this is less acceptable to me than just having the site collect my image/id. I'd support just putting the id in a dedicated device (ex - gov issues smart key) or just accepting that sometimes people will share id info (just like... physical ids). It doesn't even close all the doors to transferring ids - since I can still just hand someone a phone (jus…
If you use physical ids to verify your identity, they normally verify that your face matches the image on the id, no? That’s not possible for web id.
Ex - People change hair color, lose a boat load of weight, wear eye-color changing contacts, drastically change hair styles (facial and normal) etc...
No one bats an eye at an ID that "only sorta vaguely resembles you" outside of a very limited subset of places (the only one I can actually think of is Customs while traveling).
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So my take is that as long as the gender appears similar and the ethnicity seems "close enough"... the store is still going to sell you alcohol, the bar is going to let you in, and the movie theater is going to sell you tickets.
> "Age verification" means that everyone who does anything online will have to submit to fine-grained tracking and recording of all their online activities. its been said 1000 times here, but: age verification doesn't have to be a nightmare dystopia of 24/7 fine-grained tracking and recording unless you are somehow hoping to achieve 100% success rate (something we have not done with any other law ever). there are sev…
It doesn't even need 'age verification'. Ostensibly, the goal is to prevent children from accessing content their parents don't want them to see. That means all that's needed is a standard way for parents to make sure that websites know their children are children. They don't need identity, they don't need actual age, we don't even need a complicated cryptographic solution. California had the right idea - establish a…
This is not even ostensibly the goal. Ostensibly, the goal is that the government controls what a child can do.
Online it is happening too. No human persons will be allowed to open accounts or even communicat with other human people unless a corporate entity does it for them. This mass surveillence is just a smaller part of the greater attack on human autonomy. Only corporate persons have rights these days.
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Privacy-wise I think they're completely acceptable, but in terms of circumvention I don't think the politicians will be satisfied. It's barely a step up from the "I'm over 18" buttons on websites.
I believe kids will always find circumvention pathways. There is a signaling function these laws serve: things are the products we consider acceptable in society. We have these rules for cigarettes, booze, and vapes. That said, privacy being sacrificed for signals, is an unacceptable trade, especially when better solutions can be crafted.
I'd consider this a feature. I'd be proud if my kids find a way to circumvent the parental controls on the family computer or use their own money to build their own computer like I did growing up. At that point they've earned the right to the full internet.
(However, I would not be willing to use any solution that sacrifices my or my kid's privacy.)
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Could you be more specific as to what you're imagining? I don't personally see a way to verify someone's age which doesn't involve either credit card verification, photo id verification, or some sort of facial recognition. If you know enough about someone to verify their age—even to a relatively low degree of accuracy—you probably know enough to pinpoint who they are in general. Heck—in most cases, we can't even tell…
The way identity wallets work: The government issues an eID to your wallet. The ID is signed by the government and linked to the device to prevent transferring the credential. A public/private key-pair is generated by the secure enclave in your phone, the public key along with proof of possession of the private key is included in the request for the government eID. The government signs individual attributes combined…