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Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

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Re: Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

#341

Post by russdill »

tartoran wrote: post #88

"“We understand how upsetting this was for the individual that was searched as well as the other students who witnessed the incident,” the principal wrote. “Our counselors will provide direct support to the students who were involved.”" Make them pay money for false positives instead of direct support and counselling. This technology is not ready for production, it should be in a lab not in public buildings such as s…

I wonder how much more likely it is to get a false positive from a black student.

Re: Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

#342

Post by CyberDildonics »

perplex3d wrote: post #239
chillingeffect wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The invention of the corporation is virtually to eliminate responsibility/culpability from any individual. Human car crash? Human punishment. Corporate-owned car crash? A fine which reduces salaries some negligible percent.

Yes, corporations have all of the rights of a person, abilities beyond a person, yet few of the responsibilities of a person.

Don't forget paying their way out of crimes and no applicability to three strikes laws.

Re: Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

#343

Post by b00ty4breakfast »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #312
b00ty4breakfast wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>...its purpose is to “prioritize safety and awareness through rapid human verification. Oh look, a corporation refusing to take responsibility for literally anything. How passe.

> a corporation refusing to take responsibility for literally anything. How passe Versus all the natural people at the highest echelons of our political economic system valiantly taking responsibility for fuckall?

I certainly didn't imply that to be the case and I'm not sure how you could draw that conclusion from 2 whole sentences.

Re: Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

#344

Post by crazygringo »

Mawr wrote: post #297
crazygringo wrote: post #179

It sounds like the police mistook it as well: > “They showed me the picture, said that looks like a gun, I said, ‘no, it’s chips.’” So AI did the initial detection, but police looked at it and agreed. We don't see the image, but it probably did look like a gun because of a weird shadow or something. Fundamentally, this isn't really any different from a person seeing someone with what looks like a gun and calling the…

Picture? Images? But those are just frames of footage the cameras have captured! Why would one purposefully use less information to make a decision rather than more? Just put the full footage in front of an unbiased third party for a multi-stage verification first. The problem space isn't "is that weird shadow in the picture a gun or not?" it's "does the kid in the video have a gun?". It's not hard to figure out the…

Those are a lot of "presumablies". Maybe you're right. Or maybe it was mostly obscured so you really couldn't tell. How do you know it was open and he was eating? How do you know there were other kids around and he wasn't solo? Why do you think the body language would be so different? Nobody is claiming he was using a gun or threatening anyone with it. If you're just carrying something in your hand, I don't know how you could tell what the object is or isn't from body language.

Re: Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

#347

Post by simulator5g »

Terr_ wrote: post #242
cyanydeez wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someday there'll be a lawyer in court telling us how strong the AI evidence was because companies are spending billions of dollars on it.

You mean in the same fallacious sense of "you can tell cigarettes are good because so many people buy them"?

That sort of rhetoric works very well unfortunately.

Re: Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

#348

Post by slipperybeluga »

mrguyorama wrote: post #145
some_random wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of the security theater is to assuage the 95th percentile scared-of-everything crowd, they're the same people who want no guns signs in public parks.

No. Right from the beginning it was a handout to groups who built the scanning equipment, who were basically personal friends with people in the admin. We paid absurd prices for niche equipment, a lot of which was never even deployed and just sat in storage. Several of the hijackers were literally given extended searches by security that day. A reminder that what actually stopped hijackings (like, nearly entirely) wa…

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Re: Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

#349

Post by plorg »

zugi wrote: post #295
avidiax wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://archive.is/DYPBL > Gaggle’s CEO, Jeff Patterson, said in an interview that the school system did not use Gaggle the way it is intended. The purpose is to find early warning signs and intervene before problems escalate to law enforcement, he said. “I wish that was treated as a teachable moment, not a law enforcement moment,” said Patterson. It's entirely predictable that schools will call law enforcement for m…

Exactly. In a saner world, we could use fallible AI to call attention to possible concerns that a human could then analyze and make an appropriate judgment call on. But alas, we don't live in that world. We live in a world where there will be firings, civil, and even criminal liability for those who make wrong judgments. If the AI says "possible gun", the human running things who alerts a SWAT team faces all upside a…

I can't say that I think it would be a saner world to have the equivalent of a teacher or hall monitor sitting in on every conversation, even if that computer chaperone isn't going to automatically involve the cops. I don't think you can build a better society where everyone is expected to speak and behave defensively in every circumstance as if their words could be taken out of context by a snitch - computer or otherwise.

Re: Armed police swarm student after AI mistakes bag of Doritos for a weapon

#350

Post by krferriter »

janalsncm wrote: post #296
nkrisc wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this case false positives are far, far worse than false negatives. A false negative in this system does not mean a tragedy will occur, because there are many other preventative measures in place. And never mind the fact that this country refuses to even address the primary cause of gun violence in the first place: the ubiquity of guns in our society. So systems like this is what we end up with when we ignore to ad…

To be clear, the false negative here would be a student who has brought a gun to a school and the computer ignores it. That is a situation where potentially multiple people can be killed in a short amount of time. It is not far, far worse to send cops.

Depends on the false positive rate doesn't it. If police are being sent to storm a school every week due to a false positive, that is quite bad. And people will become conditioned to not care about reports of a gun at a school because of all the false positives.
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