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OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

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Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#341

Post by AIPedant »

jonahx wrote: post #319
iamronaldo wrote: post #103

Tyler cowen seems convinced https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2025/04/o3...

It can't solve this puzzle: https://i.imgur.com/AJqbqHJ.png Thought for 3m 51s Short answer → you can’t. The breathtaking thing is not the model itself, but that someone as smart as Cowen (and he's not the only one) is uttering "AGI" in the same sentence as any of these models. Now, I'm not a hater, and for many tasks they are amazing, but they are, as of now, not even close to AGI, by any reasonable definition.

  I think it is AGI, seriously.  Try asking it lots of questions, and then ask yourself: just how much smarter was I expecting AGI to be?
That's his whole argument!!!! This is so frustrating coming from a public intellectual. "You don't need rigorous reasoning to answer these questions, baybeee, just go with your vibes." Complete and total disregard for scientific thinking, in favor of confirmation bias and ideology.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#344

Post by echoangle »

kadushka wrote: post #309
sixQuarks wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But context windows for LLMs include all the “long term memory” things you’re excluding from humans

Long term memory in an LLM is its weights.

Not really, because humans can form long term memories from conversations, but LLM users aren’t finetuning models after every chat so the model remembers.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#345

Post by throwaway13337 »

o4-mini is available on vs code. I've been playing with it for the last couple of hours. It's quite fast for a thinking model.

It's also super concise with code. Where claude 3.7 and gemini 2.5 will write a ton, o4-mini will write a tiny portion of it accomplishing the same task.

On the flip side, in its conciseness, it's more lazy with implementation than the other leading models missing features.

For fixing very complex typescript types, I've previously found that o1 outperformed the others. o4-mini seems to understand things well here.

I still think gemini will continue to be my favorite model for code. It's more consistent and follows instructions better.

However, openAI's more advanced models have a better shot at providing a solution when gemini and claude are stuck.

Maybe there's a win here in having o4-mini or o3 do a first draft for conciseness, revise with gemini to fill in what's missed (but with a base that is not overdone), and then run fixes with o4-mini.

Things are still changing quite quickly.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#346

Post by chucky_z »

echelon wrote: post #268
fkyoureadthedoc wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not surprising. Add comments to sora.com and you've got a social network.

Seriously. The users on sora.com are already trying to. They're sending messages to each other with the embedded image text and upvoting it. GPT 4o and Sora are incredibly viral and organic and it's taking over TikTok, Instagram, and all other social media. If you're not watching casual social media you might miss it, but it's nothing short of a phenomenon. ChatGPT is now the most downloaded app this month. Images ar…

Honestly I popped on sora.com the other day and the memes are great. I can totally understand where folks are coming from and why this is happening.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#347

Post by WhatIsDukkha »

jcynix wrote: post #262
WhatIsDukkha wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would never ask any of these questions of an LLM (and I use and rely on LLMs multiple times a day), this is a job for a computer. I would also never ask a coworker for this precise number either.

My reasoning for the plain question was: as people start to replace search engines by AI chat, I thought that asking "plain" questions to see how trustworthy the answers might be, would be a good test. Because plain folks will ask plain questions and won't think about the subtle details. They would not expect a "precise number" either, i.e. not 23:06 PDT, but would like to know if this weekend would be fine for a tri…

I think its much better to help people learn that an LLM is "not" a computer (even if it technically is).

Thinking its a computer makes you do dumb things with them that they simply have never done a good job with.

Build intuitions about what they do well and intuitions about what they don't do well and help others learn the same things.

Don't encourage people to have poor ideas about how they work, it makes things worse.

Would you ask an LLM a phone number? If it doesn't use a function call the answer is simply not worth having.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#348

Post by squeaky-clean »

drcongo wrote: post #128
wilg wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are all now available on the Pro plan. Y'all really ought to have a little bit more grace to wait 30 minutes after the announcement for the rollout.

Or maybe OpenAI could wait until they'd released it before telling people to use it now .

They'd probably want their announcement to be the one the press picks up instead of a tweet or reddit post saying "Did anyone else notice the new ChatGPT model?"

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#349

Post by WhatIsDukkha »

stavros wrote: post #260
WhatIsDukkha wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would never ask any of these questions of an LLM (and I use and rely on LLMs multiple times a day), this is a job for a computer. I would also never ask a coworker for this precise number either.

First we wanted to be able to do calculations really quickly, so we built computers. Then we wanted the computers to reason like humans, so we built LLMs. Now we want the LLMs to do calculations really quickly. It doesn't seem like we'll ever be satisfied.

Ask the LLM what calculations you might or should do (and how you might implement and test those calculations) is pretty wildly useful.
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