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Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

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Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#341

Post by ignoramous »

v1ne wrote: post #293
ignoramous wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

XPrivactLua and other XposedMod/Magisk extensions break open the app sandbox. It is better to restrict running those on usereng/eng builds (test devices). For prod builds (user devices), I'd recommend using Work Profiles (GrapheneOS supports upto 31 in parallel) or Private Spaces (on Android 15+) to truly isolate apps from one another.

The question is: Who is the beneficiary of the app sandbox? Is it you, the user, because no malicious processes can taper with your apps? Or is it the corporations, because they prevent you from modifying their apps – which makes you a pure consumer? I think, for the tech-savvy, the latter is more accurate and I think it is very important to be able to crack open these sandboxes and tinker with processes. Be it to in…

> I think, for the tech-savvy, the latter is more accurate and I think it is very important to be able to crack open these sandboxes and tinker with processes

Anyone tech-savvy that wants to mod their Android (like they'd mod Linux distros), should consider purchasing Android devices (like Pixel) that support ownership transfer (that is, unlocking then relocking the bootloader), and flash CalyxOS/GrapheneOS usereng/eng builds.

Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#343

Post by TeMPOraL »

gregw2 wrote: post #330
ErigmolCt wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Submitting it to the Android VDP is a solid idea, though I wouldn't be surprised if it gets waved off as "working as intended."

The right ("as intended", in my view) functionality would be to support a manifest with, say, five apps, and if as a dev you wanted more youd apply to google for an exception (like aws limit increases) with a list of reasons for each app.

I know people may not remember this, but Android was initially designed with interoperability in mind. It's sad to see both the system development and the community opinion to have turned against it so hard.

Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#344

Post by monsieurbanana »

bloomingeek wrote: post #342

Perhaps crazy question: is it a good idea to have two phones now? One for making calls only, with as many apps as possible removed. And another phone for email, web surfing, photos, etc...? edit: Oops, I left out texting. Which phone for that?

You still make calls with your phone?

Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#345

Post by ignoramous »

schnatterer wrote: post #320
pava0 wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by "break open the app sandbox"?

I found this description about the security risks of rooting very eye-opening https://madaidans-insecurities.github.io/android.html It also explains the sandbox.

A more recent (2023) sandboxing + isolation overview by the Android team: https://arxiv.org/html/1904.05572v3/ (section 4.3)

Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#346

Post by crazygringo »

nodar86 wrote: post #327
xxprogamerxy wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple, UX. The reality is, most webapps for mobile just suck. The UX is nowhere near that of a native application. I don't want any text to be selectable. I don't want pull to refresh on every page. I don't want the left-swipe to take me to the previous page. You can probably find workarounds for all these issues. The new Silk library ( https://silkhq.co/ ) is the first case I've seen that get's very close to a nati…

> I don't want any text to be selectable Disabling text selection is not just worse UX, it is actively user-hostile

I have literally never needed to select text in a UX element.

In the past, occasionally there would be an error message in a message box dialog that I wanted to copy and paste. And then I discovered that despite it not looking selectable, it actually was.

I don't want to accidentally select the text of my menu bar, or of a text box label, or a dialog tab title.

Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#347

Post by NoahZuniga »

Jach wrote: post #60
Borealid wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When a user visits a play.google.com URL Google wants to be able to show either an "install" or a "launch" button contingent on whether the app is already installed. In other words, blame Google product management.

I don't buy this. Google has this information on their backend, they don't need to query any local state. Indeed, when I visit a play.google.com URL, google checks if my browser is logged in or not. If it is not, the default is "Install" no matter what. If I do have a session, then it's either "Install" if I don't have it installed, or "Install on more devices" if I do have it installed.

This is true, but if they didn't allow this permission for other browser apps that would be anti-competitive.

Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#348

Post by [deleted] »

turblety wrote: post #137

I still, will never understand the need for native "Apps". To this day, I have never seen an "App" that couldn't simply have been a website/webapp. Most of them would likely be improved by being a webapp. The only benefits I can see of "Apps", are the developer get's access to private information they really don't need. Yeah, they get to be on the "App Store". But the "App Store" is a totally unnecessary concept intr…

[deleted]

Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#349

Post by tshaddox »

fauigerzigerk wrote: post #246
xxprogamerxy wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple, UX. The reality is, most webapps for mobile just suck. The UX is nowhere near that of a native application. I don't want any text to be selectable. I don't want pull to refresh on every page. I don't want the left-swipe to take me to the previous page. You can probably find workarounds for all these issues. The new Silk library ( https://silkhq.co/ ) is the first case I've seen that get's very close to a nati…

>I don't want any text to be selectable. I don't want pull to refresh on every page. I don't want the left-swipe to take me to the previous page. Strange. This inability to select any text has always felt like one of the most hostile things developers could ever do. It feels like pure vandalism. Another thing that causes massive productivity degradation is not being able to keep multiple pages open so you can come ba…

Also, if my memory serves, native MacOS apps by default support selecting most text that isn’t part of a clickable element like a button.

Re: Everyone knows all the apps on your phone

#350

Post by HenryBemis »

subscribed wrote: post #303
ignoramous wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

XPrivactLua and other XposedMod/Magisk extensions break open the app sandbox. It is better to restrict running those on usereng/eng builds (test devices). For prod builds (user devices), I'd recommend using Work Profiles (GrapheneOS supports upto 31 in parallel) or Private Spaces (on Android 15+) to truly isolate apps from one another.

Can't wait for App List Scopes, like we have with Contacts or Storage already. Not a day too early. For a few months all the UK banks I have accounts in send the list of all apps to the mothership. I noticed it first when suddenly Revolut refused to start up because I had an app installed, Natwest and Nationwide at least inform prior to the data collection, but weren't concerned. It ended up with the long overdue con…

You mentioned NatWest. I remember using NatWest and noticing on NoRoot Firewall (on my Android) it was 'speaking' regularly to Facebook. Of course I had all FB and IG and their IP ranges blocked from the get-go, but still. Why (TF!!!!) would my effing back telling FB that I launched their app? (one could say that they use this or that library, so the code, blah blah blah)

This is disgusting and the reason I don't use iOS. The utter lack of firewall! (plus the batterygate scandal)

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