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America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

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Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#341

Post by bryanlarsen »

llamaimperative wrote: post #337
bryanlarsen wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In other words, the real estate market is sticky. There are large costs to moving, so consumers put up with price increases more readily than they do in other markets. But there's a big gulf between "sticky" and "laws of supply and demand don't apply". People on UBI will be much more price sensitive than those supplementing with wage income since the UBI dependent will be time rich and money poor. Landlords will have…

There's a big gulf between "eventually all marginal productivity increases are eaten by rising land rent" and "laws of supply and demand don't apply." You have no reason to believe people with new marginal income from UBI would move to lower COL areas. We have strong reason to believe they'd spend that money to move toward high COL areas. Evidence for this is the fact that people, when they have money, choose to live…

People living solely on UBI will be the poorest people in the country. It's absurd to believe that UBI will be generous enough to cover more than basic living expenses. They're not going to behave like "people with money".

Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#342

Post by eli_gottlieb »

jcranmer wrote: post #245
regularization wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Yemen, which is doing a humanitarian intervention to help the Gazans. Firing rockets indiscriminately at ships is not even in the same planet as humanitarian intervention.

Also, the Houthis are a paramilitary party, not the Yemeni state.

Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#343

Post by eli_gottlieb »

hnthrow90348765 wrote: post #175
dttze wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the optimistic take. The reality is they will find some way to cull the unwanted poor. These elites in power are stupid, cruel, spiteful, and have no sense of decency.

What I think will happen is the US tries to mimic China by creating an even lower class of our workers that form a new industrial/manufacturing base to compete with. This becomes less of a difficult pill to swallow if a) we're involved in a trade war, b) the economy has crashed and we must work our way out of it "for the country", c) the right people get enough money. They're too smart for mass murder because that wo…

> They're too smart for mass murder because that would actually spark a resistance

I don't think they're too smart for that. They're too lazy. They prefer to just gut public health and let disease take care of the culling.

Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#344

Post by llamaimperative »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #341
llamaimperative wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a big gulf between "eventually all marginal productivity increases are eaten by rising land rent" and "laws of supply and demand don't apply." You have no reason to believe people with new marginal income from UBI would move to lower COL areas. We have strong reason to believe they'd spend that money to move toward high COL areas. Evidence for this is the fact that people, when they have money, choose to live…

People living solely on UBI will be the poorest people in the country. It's absurd to believe that UBI will be generous enough to cover more than basic living expenses. They're not going to behave like "people with money".

I didn't say anything about "people living solely on UBI"

Your claim is, I guess, that people supplementing wages with UBI will move to poorer locations, because they are less tied to their jobs, and then the poorest of the poor (those who already live in bottom-percentile COL locations) will... move to even poorer locations?

Seems like a wacky argument relative to: "people will do what they literally always do with new marginal income, which is move to nicer areas, and since everyone is doing it simultaneously without new supply, prices will go up and nobody will improve their lifestyle."

Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#345

Post by greenie_beans »

llamaimperative wrote: post #338
greenie_beans wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i live in a high COL area and rent is not high because of land costs. there are several empty lots that people want to build on but the discretionary review process for entitlements make it too easy to wreck the permit process (everybody knows this in the entire world; this is the YIMBY line which has truth to it). another factor is the cost per bedroom to build is very high, due to the cost of building in the market…

What location is this?

burlington, vt. a place that has deep regulatory issues, but that is only part of it.

https://www.vermontpublic.org/local-news/2024-05-23/uvm-halt...

Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#346

Post by llamaimperative »

greenie_beans wrote: post #345
llamaimperative wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What location is this?

burlington, vt. a place that has deep regulatory issues, but that is only part of it. https://www.vermontpublic.org/local-news/2024-05-23/uvm-halt...

So 1) yes construction costs are a huge, huge factor (especially right now), but 2) land is about $1.5MM/ac in Burlington VT. A few miles outside of it, land is about $150,000/ac.

Consider a 2 acre project:

$3MM in land costs inside Burlington

$300,000 in land costs right outside Burlington

What projects would could you do on the $300,000 lot that you can't possible do on the $3MM? Basically all of them!

Regarding the UVM project: they should sell that parking lot to bring the $1.5MM/ac costs closer to $300k/ac so people can build stuff instead of a place to store asphalt :)

Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#348

Post by culopatin »

chii wrote: post #270
Animats wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. China's five year plans are translated into English and are quite readable. Here's the 14th Five Year Plan, 2021-2025.[1] Wikipedia has a summary.[2] This is China's business plan. The top level is expanded into more detailed plans at lower levels. For example, here's the plan for Fujian province.[3] Further down, here's the transition plan for IPv6.[4] You can go back and read previous five-year plans. The succ…

What makes these plans go so successfully, when the soviets have historically not been able to make such plans successful (despite being richer and more powerful at the time)? This video about Argentina's economic failures mentions why free market capitalism failed in argentina, and why a "similar" opening up in china didnt fail (but not so much detail that another country could follow it and replicate the success).…

That video is pretty… weak. Argentina can’t be looked at on a GDP graph and say “oh yeah let’s find some random country that’s similar in this graph”. Most of Argentina’s problems are self inflicted sabotage. The graphs are also very misleading in the video, not only in the axis scales.

Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#349

Post by culopatin »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #277
chii wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes these plans go so successfully, when the soviets have historically not been able to make such plans successful (despite being richer and more powerful at the time)? This video about Argentina's economic failures mentions why free market capitalism failed in argentina, and why a "similar" opening up in china didnt fail (but not so much detail that another country could follow it and replicate the success).…

Argentinas economy is a mess because of a long history of corruption. The CCP embraces markets while also having state ownership of everything by basically acting as venture capital funding different companies combined with heavy subsidies. So the 5 year plans are for signaling for which industries are going to get funding in the near future. My understanding is that this does have a pretty big impact and funding pri…

Not to mention the orders of magnitude of difference in population capital and that the people of Argentina are not under a regime that promotes basically slave labor for the benefit of their economy. Even if they did I don’t think they’d be able to produce as much just because they don’t have enough people.

Re: America Is Missing The New Labor Economy – Robotics Part 1

#350

Post by jajko »

bdangubic wrote: post #276
scotty79 wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Soviets might just really be bad at everything. Capitalism didn't work for them either.

If it wasn’t for the Soviets you’d be writing this comment in German :) And Capitalism does not work for USA or anywhere else either (except for very few people at the very top of the pyramid (scheme…)

They really did the bulk of Wehrmacht killing on European mainland. But they didn't collapse only due to massive US support, be it in armament, equipment, medicine etc. Absolutely massive. Also it was basically due to bad German planning and preparation for winter, not some soviet strategic brilliance, which was very hard to be found on eastern front, just meatwave after meatwave till german machine gun barrels literally melted.

You could see tons of US equipment during WWII reels on eastern front including heavy machinery, soviets tried desperately to remove such footage (just like photos of soviet soldiers wearing 3+ watches on each hand... err borrowed from friendly locals) but truth has this behavior of seeping back to light.

Capitalism works pretty well in any moral society actually, much better than any other system thats for sure.

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