Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era • Hacker News Board

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#341

Post by estebarb » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 1:02 AM UTC

bippihippi1 wrote: post #204

estebarb wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me that is a reason for not touching anything from Google for building stuff. I can afford lossing my Amazon account, but Google's one would be too much. At least they should be clear in their terms that getting banned at cloud doesn't mean getting banned from Gmail/Docs/Photos...

why not just make a business / project account?

I asked Gemini about banning risks, and it answered:

Gemini: Yes, there is a potential risk of your Google account being suspended if your SaaS is used to process inappropriate content, even if you use Gemini to reject the request. While Gemini can help you filter and identify harmful content, it's not a foolproof solution.

Here are some additional measures you can take to protect your account:

* Content moderation: Implement a robust content moderation system to filter out inappropriate content before it reaches Gemini. This can include keyword-based filtering, machine learning models, and human review.

...

* Regularly review usage: Monitor your usage of Gemini to identify any suspicious activity.

* Follow Google's terms of service: Make sure that your use of Gemini complies with Google's terms of service.

By taking these steps, you can minimize the risk of your account being suspended and ensure that your SaaS is used responsibly.

---

In a follow up question I asked about how to implement robust content moderation and it suggested humans reviewing each message...

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#342

Post by coder543 » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 1:09 AM UTC

int_19h wrote: post #337

coder543 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's cheaper and faster to train a small model, which is better for a research team to iterate on, right? If Google decides that a particular small model is really good, why wouldn't they go ahead and release it while they work on scaling up that work to train the larger versions of the model?

On the other hand, once you have a large model, you can use various distillation techniques to train smaller models faster and with better results. Meta seems to be very successful doing this with Llama, in particular.

> Meta seems to be very successful doing this with Llama, in particular.

Kind of sort of: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42391096

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#343

Post by jasonsteving » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 1:13 AM UTC

OutOfHere wrote: post #73

airstrike wrote: post #19

OT: I’m not entirely sure why, but "agentic" sets my teeth on edge. I don't mind the concept, but the word itself has that hollow, buzzwordy flavor I associate with overblown LinkedIn jargon, particularly as it is not actually in the dictionary...unlike perfectly serviceable entries such as "versatile", "multifaceted" or "autonomous"

To play devil's advocate, the correct use of the word would be when multiple AIs are coordinating and handing off tasks to each other with limited context, such that the handoffs are dynamically decided at runtime by the AI, not by any routine code. I have yet to see a single example where this is required. Most problems can be solved with static workflows and simple rule based code. As such, I do believe that >95% o…

You nailed an interesting nuance there about agents needing to make their own decisions!

I'm getting fairly excited about "agentic" solutions to the point that I even went out of my way to build "AgentOfCode" (https://github.com/JasonSteving99/agent-of-code) to automate solving Advent of Code puzzles by iteratively debugging executions of generated unit tests (intentionally not competing on the global leaderboard).

And even for this, there's actually only a SINGLE place in the whole "agent" where the models themselves actually make a "decision" on what step to take next, and that's simply deciding whether to refactor the generated unit tests or the generated solution based on the given error message from a prior failure.

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#344

Post by coayer » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 1:25 AM UTC

purple-leafy wrote: post #308

WA wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gemini, too, for the sole reason that non-native speakers have no clue how to pronounce it.

pronounced: juh-meany .... right?

I say jem-in-eye in my English accent, Google search says jeh·muh·nai

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#345

Post by mark_l_watson » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 1:30 AM UTC

SimianSci wrote: post #225

maeil wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> i don’t think they need to win the on device market. The second Apple comes out with strong on-device AI - and it very much looks like they will - Google will have to respond on Android. They can't just sit and pray that e.g. Samsung makes a competitive chip for this purpose.

I think Apple is uniquely disadvantaged in the AI race to a point people dont realize. They have less training data to use, having famously been focused on privacy for its users and thus having no particular advantage in this space due to not having customer data to train on. They have little to no cloud business, and while they operate a couple of services for their users, they do not have the infrastructure scale t…

It is likely Apple can get additional data by creating synthetic data for user interactions.

About 7 years ago I trained GAN models to generate synthetic data, and it worked so well. The state of the art has increased a lot in 7 years, so Apple will be fine.

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#346

Post by horyd » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 1:31 AM UTC

mherrmann wrote: post #148

Their Mariner tool for controlling the browser sounds scary and exciting. At the moment, it's an extension, which means JavaScript. Some web sites block automation that happens this way, and developers resort to tools such as Selenium. These use the Chrome DevTools API to automate the browser. It's better, but can still be distinguished from normal use with very technical details. I wonder if Google, who still own Ch…

You would think so, and probably starting the productivity suite (Docs, Sheets, etc.). If Mariner could seamlessly integrate with those, then times are about to get real interesting (if they aren't already!)

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#347

Post by mark_l_watson » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 1:31 AM UTC

serjester wrote: post #183

Buried in the announcement is the real gem — they’re releasing a new SDK that actually looks like it follows modern best practices. Could be a game-changer for usability. They’ve had OpenAI-compatible endpoints for a while, but it’s never been clear how serious they were about supporting them long-term. Nice to see another option showing up. For reference, their main repo (not kidding) recommends setting up a Kuberne…

I looked carefully at the SDK earlier today - it does look very nice, but it is also a work in progress.

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#348

Post by relatedtitle » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 2:01 AM UTC

jgalt212 wrote: post #244

Can cloudflare turnstile (and others) detect these agents as bots?

CF Turnstile is just proof of work, not a CAPTCHA. It works on automated browsers from my experience.

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#349

Post by owlninja » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 2:06 AM UTC

meta_x_ai wrote: post #327

bastardoperator wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putting your trust in Google is a fools errand. I don't know anyone that doesn't have a story.

Google has 4 Billion users. It's delusional to think that you don't know anyone or you live in an incredibly small bubble

Yea the only stories I ever see are ones that bubble up to HN. Often they are very one-sided as well. Not saying it hasn't happened, but let's not pretend it's rampant.

Re: Gemini 2.0: our new AI model for the agentic era

#350

Post by southernplaces7 » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 2:07 AM UTC

estebarb wrote: post #341

bippihippi1 wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why not just make a business / project account?

I asked Gemini about banning risks, and it answered: Gemini: Yes, there is a potential risk of your Google account being suspended if your SaaS is used to process inappropriate content, even if you use Gemini to reject the request. While Gemini can help you filter and identify harmful content, it's not a foolproof solution. Here are some additional measures you can take to protect your account: * Content moderation:…

So a convenient blah blah blah about all the nice things you can doto avoid Google's brainless algorithmic wrath, but which may simply not work anyhow because even by following all rules in good faith, you still get banned one day, as has happened to many, many people with zero recourse.