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Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

cointelegraph.com

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Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#341

Post by gruez »

paulpauper wrote: post #264
MuffinFlavored wrote: post #218

Looks like these are the 11 tickers? Bitwise (BITB) ARK Invest/21Shares (ARKB) Invesco Galaxy Bitcoin ETF (BTCO) iShares Bitcoin Trust (IBIT) VanEck Bitcoin Trust (HODL) Franklin Bitcoin ETF (EZBC) Fidelity Wise Origin Bitcoin Trust (FBTC) WisdomTree Bitcoin Trust (BTCW) Valkyrie Bitcoin Fund (BRRR) Hashdex Bitcoin Futures ETF (DEFI) Grayscale Bitcoin Trust (GBTC)

Weird how the price went to 48k on fake news, with the potential to go even higher until revealed to be fake, but only 47k on the real news?

priced in, probably.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#342

Post by peteradio »

cs702 wrote: post #273

The Bitcoin network has survived everything that has been thrown at it. Nothing has stopped the damn thing. It's always there. It's one of those things that just keeps on existing, like gold. It doesn't care what you think. It doesn't care whether you like it or not. It doesn't care if you understand it. It's just always been there. Might as well make it easier for people and companies to own it and trade Bitcoin, an…

[flagged]

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#343

Post by p4ul »

latchkey wrote: post #279
simonw wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What needs and wants is it fulfilling for you?

I've favorited off this comment for a while now: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26238410

Thank you so much for sharing this! It's definitely an interesting and valuable perspective.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#344

Post by guiambros »

koolba wrote: post #293
elif wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only losers in bitcoin are the ones that stopped. Any 5+ year holding has been ridiculously profitable. In gambling, the longer you continue, the more certain it is that you will lose. Bitcoin is a uniquely ironic form of gambling if it's gambling at all.

We’re still below the all time highs of about $68K so will need 3 more years to see if that theory plays out.

That's silly. Anyone who's dollar cost averaging bitcoin buys over a long period of time has been incredibly well rewarded. BTC is up 146% over the last 12 months, and up 15x (!) over the last 5 years.

Even if you were slow and naïve and only jumped at the 2021 all-time high, and kept buying during the next 12 months (as one should when an asset you like goes down), you'd have made your money back and then some.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#345

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

Octokiddie wrote: post #205

The strong anti-Bitcoin sentiment on HN is still amusing. It goes way back - 13 years or more. Having read many of these negative comments, I think part of this sentiment boils down to the commenter seeing no point to Bitcoin. Just this thread has examples. It must be more than a little annoying to feel very strongly that Bitcoin is pointless, but to also notice that it's still here. Year after year. If that shoe wer…

There's probably more comments promoting and defending Bitcoin on HN than ones questioning it.

The question I have is why do commenters feel the need to respond to any comment about Bitcoin that is not a (sometimes subtle) promotion or defense of it.

A reasonable person might think it's because Bitcoin is only valuable if increasingly more and more people buy it. If it's not increasingly popular or if, God forbid, everyone holding Bitcoin were to try to sell, all at once, it's Game Over. (Some folks will lose money and all Hell will break loose.)

If the first statement is false, and Bitcoin is valuable if it's unpopular, then there should be no logical reason why anyone would try to "defend" Bitcoin on HN. Why would anyone care. It's valuable even if no one is buying, right. If it lacks popularity, then this is of no consequence. Ignore it.

Alas, there is no way to test if second statement is true, i.e., it is Game Over if everyone cashes out their Bitcoin, other than this actually happening. Even still, there is no logical reason anyone would need to "defend" Bitcoin on HN if someone else believes this to be true. Why would it matter if other people hold or sell their Bitcoin.

And yet, there are consistently HN voters and commenters who seek to "defend" Bitcoin from anyone who has doubts or asks questions. That, in and of itself, may raise suspicions even more.

"Bitcoin doesn't have to do something useful for everyone to survive. It doesn;t have to "replace fiat". It doesn't have to be a payment system. It doesn't have to "go to the moon". It doesn't even need an ETF."

But somehow it needs to be constantly defended in every electronic discussion. It needs constant promotion. It needs hype.

No one can simply state "I am not interested in Bitcoin" in a discussion without triggering some "response". Regardless of the merits of Bitcoin, or absence of them, that is fscked up. Red flag.

In case anyone gets confused, I am not suggesting that any commenter literally states "I am not interested in Bitcoin" and nothing else. I am using a hypothetical example of a seemingly benign statement to illustrate the idea that _all_ comments about crypto which are not positive are quickly "countered" by Bitcoin true believers. Here is perhaps a better example. Someone states, in so many words, that Bitcoin requires large amounts of electricity. Is this untrue. It is explicitly negative. It seems quite benign yet this sort of comment will almost invariably trigger a "defense". To some, that is a red flag that there is something suspicous about these "arguments" that people feel compelled to make about Bitcoin.

Check out the film "Bitconned" if you can. Slow start but hilarious in the end. What happens when some petty criminals accidentally come in contact with hordes of "true believers". online. If I am not mistaken this was the SEC's first successful prosecution re: crypto.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#346

Post by obviouslynew »

Aunche wrote: post #262
Octokiddie wrote: post #205

The strong anti-Bitcoin sentiment on HN is still amusing. It goes way back - 13 years or more. Having read many of these negative comments, I think part of this sentiment boils down to the commenter seeing no point to Bitcoin. Just this thread has examples. It must be more than a little annoying to feel very strongly that Bitcoin is pointless, but to also notice that it's still here. Year after year. If that shoe wer…

I view Bitcoin the same way I view Herbalife. I don't have any issue with the product. I'm bothered by the misleading claims made by proponents to benefit themselves.

Well Herbalife is a corporate entity, that has governing leadership that you can challenge its 'claims' because the corporate entity makes them, sells it to people who don't know better etc. Conceptually, that means that Herbalife gives people false information, they take that and perpetuate it in their MLM for their benefit.

Bitcoin, is piece of open source software that was released on the internet 13 years ago running all over the world. With no central governing entity, all driven by software consensus mechanisms.

Would you consider that you just don't like some of the organizations that have built themselves around this network making misleading claims? Rather than the technology itself?

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#347

Post by mlrtime »

PascLeRasc wrote: post #247
Octokiddie wrote: post #205

The strong anti-Bitcoin sentiment on HN is still amusing. It goes way back - 13 years or more. Having read many of these negative comments, I think part of this sentiment boils down to the commenter seeing no point to Bitcoin. Just this thread has examples. It must be more than a little annoying to feel very strongly that Bitcoin is pointless, but to also notice that it's still here. Year after year. If that shoe wer…

You don't seem as curious as you say you'd be, framing all criticism as hostility or simple antagonism. I don't think you've considered what you're missing not trying to understand why people don't care about bitcoin.

They care enough to enter every HN thread that has positive news on the industry to shit on it. Valid criticism is fine, but insightful crypto criticism on HN is rare.

Fine, you don't like crypto. Say something new or insightful or skip the comment section.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#348

Post by baobun »

neilv wrote: post #332
Octokiddie wrote: post #205

The strong anti-Bitcoin sentiment on HN is still amusing. It goes way back - 13 years or more. Having read many of these negative comments, I think part of this sentiment boils down to the commenter seeing no point to Bitcoin. Just this thread has examples. It must be more than a little annoying to feel very strongly that Bitcoin is pointless, but to also notice that it's still here. Year after year. If that shoe wer…

> I think part of this sentiment boils down to the commenter seeing no point to Bitcoin. I thought cryptocurrency was an interesting and promising idea. But I got away from it around the time it became clear the entire space was overrun by wall-to-wall scamming . And it's safe to disregard anyone who doesn't acknowledge that. If someone says "Yeah, it's wall-to-wall scamming, and other than that, the main use of it i…

And yet, you use e-mail?

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#349

Post by cornholio »

chii wrote: post #306
cornholio wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Bitcoin just needs to fill needs (or wants) not met by anything else. That want being, in this case, the need to evade financial regulators and easily move large amounts of money untraceable. There is basically no other thing Bitcoin does better than traditional electronic cash, especially with the transaction fees reaching current values. Is it a legitimate want? It's a complex question involving personal and poli…

> move large amounts of money untraceable. paradoxically, bitcoin is the worse at this, since addresses are completely public. Unless you, like satoshi, keep the coin in the address and never spend it, any conversion to value that you can spend, such as cash, is going to be tracible. > Is it a legitimate want? yes. Unless you can prove criminality, there's the assumption of innocence.

> addresses are completely public.

Addresses in Bitcoin are pseudoanonymous. Many criminals have evaded prosecution for years (for example, the MtGox thieves) despite moving billions in the clear on the blockchain. You are feigning ignorance about the true nature of Bitcoin which is quite obviously designed to enable very strong privacy, as noted by even by its inventor in the original paper; let's not even discuss things like Monero and ZCash.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#350

Post by dcolkitt »

neilv wrote: post #332
Octokiddie wrote: post #205

The strong anti-Bitcoin sentiment on HN is still amusing. It goes way back - 13 years or more. Having read many of these negative comments, I think part of this sentiment boils down to the commenter seeing no point to Bitcoin. Just this thread has examples. It must be more than a little annoying to feel very strongly that Bitcoin is pointless, but to also notice that it's still here. Year after year. If that shoe wer…

> I think part of this sentiment boils down to the commenter seeing no point to Bitcoin. I thought cryptocurrency was an interesting and promising idea. But I got away from it around the time it became clear the entire space was overrun by wall-to-wall scamming . And it's safe to disregard anyone who doesn't acknowledge that. If someone says "Yeah, it's wall-to-wall scamming, and other than that, the main use of it i…

I guess what exactly do you define as scamming? In terms of outright fraud, I agree there's a lot. It shouldn't be super surprising that scammers tend to prefer decentralized permissionless financial rails, for the same reason that political extremists and pornographers were some of the biggest earliest users of the decentralized permissionless publishing rails of the early Internet.

But I wouldn't characterize all, or even most of crypto as scams. Gambling, maybe. Are memecoins a scam? I would say they're more like a massively multiplayer form of gambling. Which you might argue is a bad thing, and certainly is dubious from a social standpoint. But if the code is openly public and autonomous, and there's no outright deceit, I don't think gambling is really gambling.

Even beyond that, there's a lot happening in crypto that most certainly isn't scams. You have stablecoins and payment rails like USDC, stores of value like Bitcoin, smart contract chains like Ethereum, decentralized finance applications like permissionless exchanges and lending markets, social applications like farcaster, decentralized AI, and gaming.

Now you might argue that all of these things are stupid and pointless and wastes of money, but that's a separate debate. Of the large projects in these categories almost none are outright scams. They're teams experimenting with new ways to run financial markets or move payments or train models or hedge inflation. Like most technological experiments most will fail. But if that was the criteria for "scam" then the entire startup sector is also wall-to-wall scams.

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