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Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

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Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#341

Post by Gigachad »

somehnacct3757 wrote: post #242
vlunkr wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're greatly exaggerating the death of jQuery > old trick's won't work > writing is on the wall jQuery still works and is used in an crazy amount of websites. It's not going away soon. The biggest downside is the extra network request, but it's probably cached in 99% of browsers, so all that's left is some extra CPU time. You're also exaggerating the claims of jQuery defenders. No one here is arguing that t…

Chrome started partitioning the cache a couple years ago to mitigate timing attacks, so there's no network savings anymore when a bunch of sites all link to the same jQuery cdn entry.

Someone did tests on it before this and found that with how many versions and cdn sources there are, your exact jquery is almost never in the cache.

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#342

Post by jokethrowaway »

atoav wrote: post #226
DeathArrow wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I rather not write 10 lines of Vanilla JS when I can write a line using jQuery. And I do prefer jQuery-style syntax for manipulating the DOM.

As somwone who constantly replaces jquey with vanilla js the difference is more like two lines of jquery against 3 lines of vannila js. One line more. But you have one dependency less, which is quite beneficial

jQuery emerged from the market and it's pretty close to what developers wanted to express.

JS is design by a committee full of people afraid to come out as "not-as-kind" and completely detached from reality.

True, doing some of the things which were half an hour on stack overflow or 1 line of jQuery became a couple of lines of vanilla JS but the API is still pretty awful.

Think about XHR > fetch vs $.get or $.post

I agree, I'll try to use vanilla JS and google something when I need to ship some code - but for hacking around I'll just bring in jQuery and write 1-liners at blazing speed.

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#343

Post by bcrosby95 »

prohobo wrote: post #276
namdnay wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you see a lot of age discrimination it tech? What I have seen is awkward situations where you have two developers of roughly equal competence. One happens to be 45 and the other 28. Fine, nobody would care about that. Except that due to automatic annual raises, job switches, seniority bumps etc, the 45 year old developer is paid twice as much as the junior. The rational response to this would be to say to align th…

Really? I see 40+ people as diversity hires for the most part. They're there so no one can say the company is ageist. The "good" devs become managers or magically disappear. Magically as in they get banished to some other realm I've never been able to see. That, to me, says there's plenty of ageism. If it was as simple as "they ask for too much", then someone would snap them out of it and we'd see plenty of older dev…

I don't know if we're just exceptionally lucky, but my friend group - the vast majority of which are still doing coding/sysadmin/devopsy stuff - are in our 40s and we have all had no problem finding employment.

I think a major factor is that the field just exploded so much over the past 20 years. Statistically, people over 40 are going to be in the minority.

I also do think a lot of startups maybe aren't the best place for older people. My brain wastes a lot of cycles on edge cases I've learned to identify from experience, that don't matter if you just need to slop some shit out the door ASAP.

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#344

Post by CryptoBanker »

threatofrain wrote: post #318
fallingknife wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't speak for Hack Reactor, but your generalization of "bootcamps like" is wrong. Went to a bootcamp in 2016 and was doing React/Redux on the front end.

> Bootcamps such as Hack Reactor (purchased by Galvanize) No, this generalization is quite correct. If you went to a bootcamp which was not such as Hack Reactor, then perhaps you may wish to promote the program by name and discuss your experience there.

I went to Fullstack Academy in 2017 and React and Redux were both part of the core curriculum

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#345

Post by smrtinsert »

reggieband wrote: post #137

When I first started programming I was pretty lucky to get a job at a games company. My first lead was a veteran who had shipped a lot of AAA titles and he loved his war stories. He was personally interested in performance and he would often cite hardware timings for specific cpu instructions. One story he told a couple of times was about some grey beard who was before his time. The grey beard was once a legend in th…

Yeah this is why I fired my contractor for using a wrench. A hammer should be good enough.

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#346

Post by smrtinsert »

DeathArrow wrote: post #206
reggieband wrote: post #137

When I first started programming I was pretty lucky to get a job at a games company. My first lead was a veteran who had shipped a lot of AAA titles and he loved his war stories. He was personally interested in performance and he would often cite hardware timings for specific cpu instructions. One story he told a couple of times was about some grey beard who was before his time. The grey beard was once a legend in th…

I rather not write 10 lines of Vanilla JS when I can write a line using jQuery. And I do prefer jQuery-style syntax for manipulating the DOM.

Exactly, I don't know why people have to pit jQuery against the current generation of ui or vdoms etc. Just because you have a car doesn't mean a bike doesn't have its uses.

These threads are completely ridiculous.

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#347

Post by tiborsaas »

DeathArrow wrote: post #244
tiborsaas wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then compare it with dog's and pick the simpler one :) I don't know what's wrong with a utils.js file that only has what you need in a way that fits your project exactly. Woof.

But writing that utils.js will end up rewriting jQuery.

I've seen this argument a lot, but based on my experience it will take ~5 small functions to get what I need and how I need.

It's even easier if you copy paste from here: https://anguscroll.com/just/

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#348

Post by edoloughlin »

dlandis wrote: post #234
reggieband wrote: post #137

When I first started programming I was pretty lucky to get a job at a games company. My first lead was a veteran who had shipped a lot of AAA titles and he loved his war stories. He was personally interested in performance and he would often cite hardware timings for specific cpu instructions. One story he told a couple of times was about some grey beard who was before his time. The grey beard was once a legend in th…

> But to me, they are like the old grey beard who didn't update his knowledge as the times changed. Maybe it's just me but with all the rampant age discrimination nowadays in tech, I really don't like to see the continued propagation of this stereotype. All sorts of people of all ages are unwilling or unable to update their knowledge of new tech, there is no reason to link this characteristic to someones advanced age…

>> But to me, they are like the old grey beard who didn't update his knowledge as the times changed.

> Maybe it's just me but with all the rampant age discrimination nowadays in tech, I really don't like to see the continued propagation of this stereotype.

I would agree. If you last a long time in tech, you're more than the sum of the libraries you've learned.

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#349

Post by wvenable »

egeozcan wrote: post #304
wvenable wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I mean, you normally abstract these things with a helper fn or two, without importing the whole jQuery anyway. Add enough helper functions are you're at jQuery anyway. Looking at the jQuery source code, it manages a lot of edge cases that I don't really have time to figure out on my own. The DOM API isn't really designed that well for human consumption. https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API/Node/nodeTy..…

You need to write a lot of helpers to come close to jQuery. Also edge cases aren't that big of a deal now that IE is near it's EOL.

I'm not talking about browser edge cases, I'm talking about API edge cases. The DOM API is not very human-friendly.

Re: Gov.uk drops jQuery from their front end

#350

Post by tambourine_man »

SEJeff wrote: post #241
reggieband wrote: post #137

When I first started programming I was pretty lucky to get a job at a games company. My first lead was a veteran who had shipped a lot of AAA titles and he loved his war stories. He was personally interested in performance and he would often cite hardware timings for specific cpu instructions. One story he told a couple of times was about some grey beard who was before his time. The grey beard was once a legend in th…

Amusingly, I always joke that I'm fluent in jQuery, but no absolutely no javascript. As a mostly backend go/python/non-javascript developer that has always held true. It is just a tool in the belt for an engineer. Can you use jQuery in 2022 or later to solve really amazing problems that impact user experience? You sure can! Would you be better off to use a modern javascript variant and stuff like react instead? You a…

>Would you be better off to use a modern javascript variant and stuff like react instead? You also absolutely would.

Why?

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