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Open-Sourcing our Firmware

frame.work

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Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#341

Post by Lio »

vaylian wrote: post #335
Lio wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn’t buy a Framework right now because they come bundled with Windows and not Linux. I want paid Linux support upfront. I don’t want to pay for Windows support, remove it and then run unsupported Linux on my laptop. A manufacturer saying “this is a Windows laptop but we won’t stop you running Linux on it” isn’t really good enough for what I want.

> I wouldn’t buy a Framework right now because they come bundled with Windows and not Linux. That only applies to the prebuild laptop. The DIY edition gives you the option to buy the laptop without an operating system. It's fairly easy to assemble the DIY edition yourself and save money by DIY. They officially support Linux: https://frame.work/blog/linux-on-the-framework-laptop

That’s still not quite what I’m looking for.

It’s not the “not paying for Windows” angle for me. I don’t care much about that.

I can just treat it like an unused part of the package, like a foreign power adapter. It might even be useful someday.

What I really want is to positively pay for vendor Linux support, pre-installed.

I want the vendor to benefit from Linux and know why they’re supporting it for me.

I guess they could change that in the future though so it’s still worth keeping an eye on.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#342

Post by dsego »

orthecreedence wrote: post #325
dsego wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

fn+arrow combo is imho equally as usable

I hate fn+arrow as an alternative to having real home/end/pgup/pgdown keys. It's probably the thing I hate most about my blade laptop.

Why? Do you feel similar about not having a "real" dedicated key to ctrl+c / ctrl+v ?

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#343

Post by brightball »

anyfoo wrote: post #125
brightball wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, it’s always a struggle. UI wise it clearly looks better to use flags and people know what it’s for when they see it. There’s always people who complain about it though. I’m of the opinion to not worry about it and just use the flags. It’s enough effort to properly internationalize a site and keep it maintained. That it’s available at all is a huge effort. Debating flags vs a drop down with languages is nitpickin…

As someone who grew up multilingually in Europe but now lives in the US and works for a US company (which seems to get localization right), I have the impression you don't really know the confusion and difficulties that arise from what you are saying. To explain, let's turn it around. Assuming you also live in the US, imagine a EU company would make the following assumptions that are common (to the point of feeling e…

I’m very familiar with it after working for a company which does a tremendous amount of business in Europe. Our European office, based in the Netherlands, just wanted to use some Google translate proxy service rather than properly internationalize anything.

If anything, I cared a lot more about getting it right than anyone else but it is a lot of work.

My point is that with all of the work a company has to put in to even make a proper language choice available, complaining about flags is literally just finding a reason to be bothered.

It’s like somebody built you a house just how you wanted it, but you latched onto the color of the front door to complain.

So yes, 100%…if flags make your site look better just use flags and ignore the noise. If you want to do it a different way, do that. You’re investing the time to get it right, you don’t have time to deal with petty complaints about the selection box.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#344

Post by OneLeggedCat »

stavros wrote: post #212
ad8e wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The scrambling is easy to see once you know it's happening: press k and l simultaneously on your Thinkpad keyboard. It'll always come out "lk" unless you deliberately separate them. Testing was done [0], but it's not written in an easy-to-understand way. As a summary, Thinkpad keys are scrambled within 15-23 ms. Usually, humans ascribe scrambled letters to their own mistakes, but this time it's the keyboard's fault.…

Oh man, is that why pressing "iu" quickly would come out as "ui"? I know I press them correctly, because I use the middle and ring fingers together simultaneously, with the longer finger obviously striking one key first, yet they'd always come out wrong.

Wow. All these years it's been the keyboard, not me. Kinda mildly infuriating.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#345

Post by stavros »

OneLeggedCat wrote: post #344
stavros wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh man, is that why pressing "iu" quickly would come out as "ui"? I know I press them correctly, because I use the middle and ring fingers together simultaneously, with the longer finger obviously striking one key first, yet they'd always come out wrong.

Wow. All these years it's been the keyboard, not me. Kinda mildly infuriating.

Yeah, it really is, and people didn't believe me when I said with certainty that it was the keyboard's fault.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#346

Post by namibj »

lukeschlather wrote: post #272
ad8e wrote: post #165

I checked the keyboard debouncing logic [0] and it was fine. Some keyboards from other manufacturers, notably Lenovo Thinkpads, have absurd debouncing algorithms that scramble keys or add delays, so it's good to see Framework has a correct solution. [0]: https://github.com/FrameworkComputer/EmbeddedController/blob...

This reminds me of a weird issue I have with my Lenovo where sometimes the trackpoint and mouse buttons stop working until a reboot (but the trackpad still works.) I think I must trigger a race condition in the trackpoint drivers somehow but I have no idea how to debug it.

I remember such an issue; unloading and reloading the kernel module fixed it.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#347

Post by Already__Taken »

ohazi wrote: post #155
alufers wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry for changing the topic but does anybody know the reason Intel has removed the seep states? It drives me absolutely nuts when I open my bag and feel the heat coming out of it, and my laptop is left with 20% charge.

I believe the push came from Microsoft. Apple has been able to do "clever" things while asleep, like waking up the wifi chipset periodically to check for email / messages / notifications / updates, so that when you wake up, everything magically feels ready to go instead of feeling like you just woke up from 1984 and have reams of crap to download. But this only works well because Apple does their own firmware for mos…

Why is this hard? Like I know it's all hard. But is it just new? or is it not documented at all, or some structural issue with how distros expect states to work?

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#348

Post by spookthesunset »

avianlyric wrote: post #336
alar44 wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if you make $10 on each of those that's .1%. Or even if it's only $1 that's 1%. So be it! I don't want to encourage shitty design for pennies at any level. Stop making shitty shit.

There aren’t that many 1% in 100% or even that many 0.1% in 100%. Saving a penny on the keyboard will be one of hundreds of places where a penny was saved. Good engineering and product design is about trade offs and compromise, not taking absolute positions about what’s shitty or not.

Exactly. Opportunity cost. Maybe saving a penny on this portion of the keyboard let’s them spend a penny on some other part of the design that might have even more positive customer impact.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#349

Post by TranquilMarmot »

Shared404 wrote: post #316
TranquilMarmot wrote: post #209

I bought a Framework for personal use and love it so much. I have it running Windows 11, if only because it was easier to get longer battery life out of it without doing endless tweaks on a *nix OS. Upsides: - Hardware feels VERY premium and nice. It's not too heavy. You'd never guess it's the first laptop made by a new company. - Keyboard is a pleasure to type on. I did nanowrimo last year on it and wrote ~60k words…

> a few Docker images running and VSCode with a medium-sized Node project open, I'm admittedly a hobbyist/novice programmer, but this isn't necessarily what I'd call light.

What's funny is that when I originally wrote that comment, I had "light" in quotation marks to mean that it's not _really_ light programming, but it's a lot less than what I have running for work.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#350

Post by alufers »

danuker wrote: post #273
alufers wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry for changing the topic but does anybody know the reason Intel has removed the seep states? It drives me absolutely nuts when I open my bag and feel the heat coming out of it, and my laptop is left with 20% charge.

The correct course of action is to return the "defective" product.

Unfortunately it's my work laptop.
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