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Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

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Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#341

Post by skinkestek »

Jensson wrote: post #322
skinkestek wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I admit you have a good point. I counted the ones I can remember: - search (although this one barely qualifies in my opinion) - GMail/GSuite (once provided ever increasing storage, also killed free GSuite etc etc but I'll count it, it exists and has even expanded a bit) - YouTube - Ads - Android - Chrome Quite a portfolio actually. Says something about how much I dislike them when I had to think long and hard to…

Maps and docs as well. While Facebook is the king of time wasting apps, Google is the king of useful apps. They might abuse their role a bit, but at least the products are things that helps people.

And now that I think of it GCP is still alive, for now at least.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#342

Post by throwawaythekey »

Gentil wrote: post #93

I don't have much data points to share. But I've been seeing responses to people working FB have been horrible since for a while now. It has been a common trend that when someone I know posts a job position in FB, nobody replies to it. At least not publicly (publicly means replying to tweet, replying to slack message in a well knit/known group of people). Even if they are replying personally and privately, that in it…

FB might have some negatives to society as a whole but there are also some positives (besides being able to talk to your family).

The ad product has enabled a whole new generation of entrepreneurs. I really can't understate how pivotal facebook has been -> because they know so much about you the targeting can be REALLY REALLY effective. For many products the traditional competitors like google can't even come close.

Being an e-commercialist+advertiser may make me biased but I've grown to love Zuck much more than I would've previously been comfortable with.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#343

Post by ma2rten »

p1esk wrote: post #313
smnscu wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been doing Karat interviews for about three years and it's been incredible for my mental health. The work is extremely flexible and there is nothing to worry about when you're not working (I dread deadlines and I'm neurotic enough to never manage a good WLB at a regular SWE gig). The compensation is also pretty good. Apply on their website if interested ( https://karat.com/ ) or hit me up at my username at googl…

The compensation is also pretty good. What is the compensation?

I googled it and it said $60-$100 per hour, which is not that great compared to Facebook pay or other contracting gigs.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#344

Post by ma2rten »

jensensbutton wrote: post #211
lordnacho wrote: post #32

I would guess people evaluate their job on money/work/stink axes. All of FAANG pays well, so what's left is whether the work is interesting/important/fulfilling and whether the company has integrity/evil issues. Eg you might think F1 has interesting problems despite glorifying fossil fuel cars, or you might think drones are technically challenging despite being used to kill people. Loads of people become nurses and t…

I don't know, I think if you're interested in VR/AR, wearables, computer vision, building products for the "creator" generation, or even crypto (Novi) then FB/Meta probably has the best work pitch of all the FAANGs.

Google has by far the best team in computer vision.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#345

Post by akomtu »

bottle_roket wrote: post #236
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the inside perspective > Couple this with a culture that has masterminded a set of carrots and sticks that gets people to push themselves very hard all of the time, I’m completely burnt out. Can you say more about the work/life balance? I've heard Facebook's work life balance described as everything from a cushy "engineer retirement home" to a grueling crushing workload that few can handle. Obviously FB is…

Obviously it’s a huge company with thousands of teams, but I’ve been an engineer on 3 different product teams and certain things have been the same everywhere. I would say purely from a coding perspective the workload is typical ~40ish hours a week. The stress comes from the biannual performance reviews that grade you explicitly across 4 axis. If you got your projects delivered on time with high quality code that’s j…

Those extra axes seem easy to fake. Just "review" all code reviews you see - takes 5 sec per CR and your metrics skyrocket. Mission of the team? Write some bs docs with vision and ideas: nobody needs them, but you get to mark the checkbox. Team culture? Say you've organized a book reading club, even do a couple meetings - just bring a book there and mark the checkbox. Books don't actually need to be read. Want to score some diversity points? Say your book reading club studied "white fragility" - nobody is going to verify you havent and nobody really cares, but you get to mark the checkbox.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#346

Post by int_19h »

throwaway47292 wrote: post #183

The bubble we (hn) live in, is turning against fb/google/evil corp for various reasons, but the truth is, like any corp they will have ups and downs, if this meta shit pays out (fortnite skins for 2 billion people is basically infinite money) they will just buy their way out. Or they will buy the devs in another way, like apple is buying them indirectly for 30% commission on their apps. Worse case, you get survivor b…

> Worse case, you get survivor bias of people without moral compass, as anyone who cares leaves

Conversely, perhaps that's precisely what needs to happen for the legal banhammer to come down?

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#347

Post by sundvor »

akomtu wrote: post #345
bottle_roket wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously it’s a huge company with thousands of teams, but I’ve been an engineer on 3 different product teams and certain things have been the same everywhere. I would say purely from a coding perspective the workload is typical ~40ish hours a week. The stress comes from the biannual performance reviews that grade you explicitly across 4 axis. If you got your projects delivered on time with high quality code that’s j…

Those extra axes seem easy to fake. Just "review" all code reviews you see - takes 5 sec per CR and your metrics skyrocket. Mission of the team? Write some bs docs with vision and ideas: nobody needs them, but you get to mark the checkbox. Team culture? Say you've organized a book reading club, even do a couple meetings - just bring a book there and mark the checkbox. Books don't actually need to be read. Want to sco…

This sounds like some different version of hell to me.

But hey, if you can make it work - and it sounds like you do - then all the power to you! :) I must admit I do like seeing the middle digit you're raising in their direction there.

(Edit: Even though CRs ought to be taken seriously, for the sake of your fellow engineers).

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#348

Post by Aeolos »

3np wrote: post #316
exBarrelSpoiler wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The issue is that, sadly, unfortunately, a lot of candidates simply can't do the job. And, tragically, they don't even understand how bad they are and they apply to tens if not hundreds of places making them overrepresented in the candidates' pool. How did it come to this? You don't see this in other engineering industries. There's not a ton of incapable civil engineers bouncing from interview to interview. You don…

> Are these candidates truly incapable of doing the job, or are the understanding of what the job entails misunderstood by everyone involved? On the other hand, is something wrong in how software engineers are educated to cause this surplus of incompetents? Does there need to be better training in this industry? Yes, yes, yes, and yes. Pretty confident that the lack of in-house training has been mostly facilitated by…

I wanted to say that this echoes my experience perfectly.

After interviewing several hundreds of people, two surprising things stood out:

- a large percentage of technical applicants cannot program even in languages where they claim multiple years of work experience

- this holds true for non-technical applicants too

I think this is a combination of poor applicants being overrepresented in the applicant pool (good ones get hired), the fact that modern job complexity has grown compared to previous generations, and the desire for people to "hit the ground running".

I don't know what's the solution. Fields that require certification don't seem to be suffering as much, but that has significant side effects too. What I know is the times where people would work for the same company for 30+ year, where they'd get taught what they needed on the job, are not coming back.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#350

Post by xwowsersx »

How does the author know this is due to specific issues at Facebook and isn't just due to the job market being as competitive as it has recently become? Perhaps it was difficult get people at facebooks to leave, but now, with the market as tight as is it and with compensation everywhere soaring, perhaps it's reached a level where even Facebook is seeing attrition.
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