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Tech compensation in 2021

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Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#341

Post by pcmoney »

seoulmetro wrote: post #114
i1856511 wrote: post #40

How many people go into programming now simply for the money? More than 70%? What percentage of programmers would still be programmers if competitive salary was not a concern in life, and people were free to simply pursue their passions?

Outside the US this is more like 10-20%. Americans care about money a lot. American SWE care about money even more.

I mean sure but the track record of American Tech Companies speaks for itself.

Wanna know what the truly passionate programmer does? Ship things that make money.

If they don’t they are a hobbyist not a professional because it isn’t a profession for them.

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#342

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

throwaway2016a wrote: post #90

20 years experience, two books under my belt, and lead architect (with a CTO title) on several good sized projects and most I have ever gotten in $175k... every time I see an article like this, I think I am doing something "very wrong" I live about 40 miles outside of Boston. Edit: Looking at levels.fyi for Boston that actually puts me above the median[1]. Why the heck is Boston so low compared to other markets? Edit…

How many of your employers have the cash flow that FAANG companies have. The idea that non-FAANG companies should be able to match FAANG salaries regardless of what non-FAANG companies have to spend on staff seems a rather distorted concept. As the article mentions, FAANG could actually be paying their employees much more. They can afford it, easily.

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#343

Post by pcmoney »

i1856511 wrote: post #40

How many people go into programming now simply for the money? More than 70%? What percentage of programmers would still be programmers if competitive salary was not a concern in life, and people were free to simply pursue their passions?

Honestly, I prefer to work with people who are in it long term for the money. Much more rational, much more pragmatic, much less bike shedding and holy wars, much higher degree of professionalism.

“How do we ship things that make us rich” vs “how do I scratch this nerd itch/play with new shiny thing/assert my passion purity”

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#344

Post by coliveira »

beebmam wrote: post #50
cryptoz wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Taxes are higher in Europe, which disincentivizes risk taking and ambitious individuals. This seems backwards to me. A society with higher taxes typically has better social safety nets, better infrastructure, less corruption, etc. Higher-tax societies incentivize risk-taking, not the other way around, especially for "ambitious individuals". When there is more structure and support around, more people are able to ta…

It seems to me that risk taking is probably deeply cultural, and is also likely effected by both policy and economic status (collective and individual status). It's probably hard to know how to quantify all of these different effects, but I hope some people are trying to research this!

Culture is not that hard to change when there is money involved. The difference in SV is that there is so much venture capital willing to create new companies. Given that amount of capital, there will always be someone willing to do it.

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#345

Post by lumost »

throwaway2016a wrote: post #90

20 years experience, two books under my belt, and lead architect (with a CTO title) on several good sized projects and most I have ever gotten in $175k... every time I see an article like this, I think I am doing something "very wrong" I live about 40 miles outside of Boston. Edit: Looking at levels.fyi for Boston that actually puts me above the median[1]. Why the heck is Boston so low compared to other markets? Edit…

Fellow Bostonian here, You need to look at large cap publicly traded tech companies.

There are a few home grown publicly traded Boston employers such as HubSpot, and to a lesser extent Wayfair which pay competitively. However there are also large presences from Salesforce, Amazon, Google, Microsoft, FB, Spotify and others who pay more competitively.

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#346

Post by throwaway2016a »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #292
throwaway2016a wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no data to back that up but I think you may be right. We always show salary as a normal distribution but maybe it is bimodal.

> We always show salary as a normal distribution but maybe it is bimodal. Who are we? Which salaries? Starting salaries for lawyers are one of the most famous examples of a bimodal distribution you can find. Salaries across the country generally are less bimodal than that. But salaries shouldn't be modeled as a normal distribution in any event. They skew high very easily, and they can never skew low.

Sites like Salary.com mostly.

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#347

Post by lotsofpulp »

throwaway2016a wrote: post #269
sokoloff wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The money is out there and $175K/yr is nowhere near the top of the market for your experience in the Boston area. That’s not to say you’re doing something wrong if you’re optimizing for the many things other than money that are worthwhile.

Not near the top, no, but according to the numbers it is median. I'm sure there are larger salaries out there but this article makes it sound like it is normal. Which in a roundabout way was my point.

Median is not a useful measure in these matters. Deciles, or even quintiles, would actually be useful.

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#348

Post by bertr4nd »

matthewbauer wrote: post #303
eegg7 wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best thing I did for my career was leave Boston for an entry level FANG job on the West Coast 10 years ago. I currently make more than 10x what I was making in Boston. But it has been a grind no doubt. And probably some luck.

Sorry, 10x seems like a crazy difference when talking about salary. Could you be more specific? I’m trying to figure out numbers that make sense. Like you were getting $30,000 a year in 2011 and now getting $300,000+ in 2021? In the same field? Either the Boston salary was crazy low or fang salary is crazy high.

I’m not the OP but if they’re L7+ the current salary (total comp, really) could be 800k+

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#349

Post by Jensson »

jfcllotr wrote: post #317
loeg wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Leetcode will only cover the easiest part (IMO) of the interview. For senior roles, expect to spend half or more of the interview on “system design” and “behavioral” interviewing.

This ^. I’m surprised most people don’t realize this. After a certain level, leetcode is 30% of your interviews. Your level is decided by system design and behavioral, which IMO you’ll do naturally better at with experience

Your level is mostly determined by years of experience and level of previous positions. Your level might get down adjusted if you perform badly on these interviews, but it wont get adjusted up if you perform well. And passing these interviews is trivial if you actually did your job and didn't waste your years of experience, so the limiting factor is still mostly leetcode and years of experience. (Although experience at better companies is valued higher)

Re: Tech compensation in 2021

#350

Post by lotsofpulp »

hnxs wrote: post #123
ecshafer wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boston has a lot of robotics which seems to pay less for some reason (less profitable? Can't scale as cheaply?) and biotech which pays less. That could be one cause.

it’s easier to offshore why? i don’t know, it’s definitely not any easier work. but it’s reflected in the comp

In order to negotiate high compensation, you must be selling something in high demand and selling to someone with lots of cash (or cash equivalent like FAANG RSU). I suspect robotics companies’ cash flow does not look like the FAANG company’s.
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