Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices • Hacker News Board

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#341

Post by xnyan » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 4:23 PM UTC

TeMPOraL wrote: post #283

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you really think "old" Microsoft thought that far into the future for this back then? This was before the days of software becoming walled-garden lock-in subscription-ware; when quarterly revenue relied solely on the number of licenses sold and pirated licenses were seen as lost revenue. I assumed they just though that if everyone had only legit copies, then Microsoft's revenues would quintuple overnight effective…

> Do you really think "old" Microsoft thought that far into the future for this back then? I always assumed so, and same for Adobe. For many years, their software was trivial to pirate. My understanding is, they let individuals pirate Windows/Photoshop to ensure widespread popularity, especially among people who wouldn't be able to pay for that software anyway - and applied pressure to any business using their softwa…

> For many years, their software was trivial to pirate

Many years, including this year (or at least, that's what a "friend" who's running Photoshop 2021 tells me).

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#342

Post by ksdale » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 4:28 PM UTC

rhacker wrote: post #56

ksdale wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm no corporate shill, but corporations are groups of people, so anything you think it's ok to take away from them because they're a group and not a person, you could logically take away from, say, a union or a farmer's market. If it was wise to make that law regarding facebook, would it be wise to make it regarding an individual as well, or should individuals be allowed to do it because they're not groups? And if i…

So backing up out of that for a second. Are you saying there are individuals (not part of a group, or a corporation) that are dead set on making computer peripherals that require an account?

Is that relevant? I think the analysis should revolve around whether they should be allowed to, and not whether we can just ban it because nobody wants to do it anyway. I don't think that's a good way to make rules.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#343

Post by ksdale » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 4:31 PM UTC

tpxl wrote: post #259

ksdale wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm no corporate shill, but corporations are groups of people, so anything you think it's ok to take away from them because they're a group and not a person, you could logically take away from, say, a union or a farmer's market. If it was wise to make that law regarding facebook, would it be wise to make it regarding an individual as well, or should individuals be allowed to do it because they're not groups? And if i…

The connection between corps and unions/farmers markets is clear to me, but the jump between unions/farmers markets to individuals is not. Yes, I do think groups should not have rights individuals have. It's more about the scale than the amount of people, and the line between that gets blurred when an individual can control thousands of PCs.

For example, individuals are entitled to freedom of assembly, the ability to, say, gather and push for better labor conditions. If we restrict the rights of groups, would the government suddenly say, "Well sure, each of you can ask for labor rights individually, but you can't gather together to do it, because groups shouldn't have the same rights as individuals."

I suppose, I don't think the line between groups and individuals is quite so clear. When does a group become "greater" than the individual in a way that requires the individual to give up certain rights?

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#344

Post by lovecg » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 4:36 PM UTC

LegitShady wrote: post #225

fastball wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Still not following how it is ethically wrong to accept technology freely given by others.

The employees who advocated 'freely giving' the technology away jumped off to the other company basically right away. It was sabotage by unethical employees. If that's unclear to you, you're probably going to have problems on the ethics exam.

Who signed off on the decision to give the tech away? Anyone can advocate for anything, at the end of the day someone is in charge and the questionable business move is on them.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#345

Post by reasonabl_human » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 5:14 PM UTC

dylan604 wrote: post #22

whyrusleeping wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> GrapheneOS is compatible with several Google Pixel smartphones. That doesn't bode well for things working all that well. As someone who ran linux on chromebook for two years, then on a macbook for three, i'm a bit burnt out on this sort of thing.

It's like a rite of passage or something to hack and then install your own thing fighting harder than a salmon swimming up stream. There's a lot to be learned in the doing to be sure. It's the full of piss&vinegar stage of life. Eventually, you get tired of the time required to fight it, and just need something to work. Does that mean the man won? Maybe. However, I look at it like I won on finally becoming mature eno…

Couldn’t agree more. Recently hit the stage of needing things to ‘just work’ to free up time in other directions, whereas I used to constantly load new roms from xda onto a rooted pixel, or tinker with getting coreboot to run on an old thinkpad with arch..

Now it’s iOS / macOS / iCloud and a headless Ubuntu box. Never been more productive and never had more free time. Choose your battles.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#346

Post by iamtheworstdev » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 5:41 PM UTC

malermeister wrote: post #224

canada_dry wrote: post #135

Won't Oculus simply add some oculess detection code to their next developer release so that any future apps and updates to existing apps stop working all together if detected?

And then inevitably somebody will find a way around that. It's a cat-and-mouse game as old as the concept of digital licensing - see the piracy space, where all sorts of uncrackable protections keep getting cracked

but it's a cat and mouse game to effectively disable your hardware because you can't use any of the software you want to use with it?

i feel like simply not playing is the real way to win this game. otherwise facebook still profits

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#347

Post by LegitShady » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 5:47 PM UTC

wly_cdgr wrote: post #338

LegitShady wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

also see this comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28871907 Carmack's actions in light of the pattern of Oculus acquiring tech from valve in shady ways can't be seen as anything other than just another guy betraying his former employer for oculus. A giant stain on his reputation for anyone who can see just how oculus was built.

I read that thread and it has insider reports about how Valve chose to give its tech away to Oculus. How is that Oculus' fault? Also don't see the issue with Carmack. Code you write ethically belongs to you, no matter what the law or your employment contract says

"valve" is a company made of people. Some people in valve pushed for valve to give away the tech to oculus, and then those same people left valve for oculus. That's not innocent. It's unethical.

Code you write under contract to an employer doesn't belong to you. Someone paid you for that.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#348

Post by Epskampie » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 7:18 PM UTC

Guillaume86 wrote: post #336

tristor wrote: post #329

I've been wanting to use PCVR for a long time, especially for virtual desktop scenarios, not even just for gaming. But the reality is I will never buy anything that puts money in Facebook's pocket. End of story. I really appreciate the work the developer did on this, but philosophically I see things like this that attempt to break the walled garden as a net-benefit to a bad actor (Facebook) rather than a net-benefit…

Why do you think it's a net benefit for facebook? They probably make a loss if you buy a headset, don't buy anything on the store and un-facebook it.

The team at facebook will be able to show bigger sales, making the next version more likely. You will count as a "oculus quest user" in steam stats etc. Developers will be more likely to support this headset. Etc etc etc. The market is still so small that network effect like these can be huge.

Facebook is selling at a loss in an attempt to destroy the competition and build another monopoly. They don't care if they don't make a profit now, as they will be able to gauge you later.

Don't buy facebook stuff.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#349

Post by snvzz » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 7:22 PM UTC

cardanome wrote: post #303

Facebook should have never been allowed to buy them. It is really annoying because there is basically no alternative to it if you want a stand alone VR headset.

They do not have a "stand alone VR headset".

It's tied to the FB cloud. Not standalone AT ALL.

Re: Oculess – Removes account requirements and telemetry from Oculus Quest devices

#350

Post by snvzz » Fri, Oct 15, 2021, 7:27 PM UTC

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #163

ziml77 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Razer is even worse than a mandatory account. When you connect a Razer device (including changing the port it's plugged into), Windows will try to execute the Razer software installer. It's really annoying.

You can turn off that in Windows Settings

Could you elaborate on how?