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FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

fda.gov

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Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#341

Post by defaultprimate »

enumjorge wrote: post #329
defaultprimate wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a great chasm between direct action resulting in tragedy and inaction for the preservation of autonomy having an infinitesimally small probability of directly resulting in tragedy. Comparing choosing to drive drunk with not choosing to take a particular action that has an infinitesimally small probability of directly causing tragedy are not remotely comparable.

We’re talking about health guidelines at the state and national level here. What matters is the big picture not a single data point. No one cares if Joe has the vaccine, we care that X% percentage of the total population has been infected or that Y% percentage of people are vaccinated. We’re in a tech forum do I really need to explain this? The probability of an individual hard drive failing is small. If you’re build…

Leaky vaccines provide a high degree of selective pressure on viruses. Who knew?!

Literally hundreds of renowned virologists and epidemiologists, that's who.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#342

Post by FunHearing3443 »

NineStarPoint wrote: post #244
peakaboo wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if true, so what? It's their bodies. They should be allowed to choose, just like you are.

Because in cases like this, the choice they’re making with their body can be directly responsible for the hospitalization and death of other people in their vicinity. Vaccines aren’t fool proof, every person who doesn’t take the vaccine is an increased chance for those who did take the vaccine to get exposed to a breakthrough case. I know I wouldn’t want to work in person at any place that didn’t have a vaccine manda…

"Once vaccines are approved for children, I think people's options should be to either vaccinate their child or homeschool them"

Alternative perspective, why should the unvaxed kids be forced into homeschooling? Maybe the parents of vaxed kids should be given the option of putting their vaxed kid in a school that has a mix of vaxed and unvaxed kids, or to homeschool? Given the general demographics of the unvaxed I'd say that's far more likely to happen then a school vax mandate. They would never get away with turning away a bunch of African-American kids going to some of the strapped inner city schools. Food for thought.

An alternative that could happen is vaxed / unvaxed kids in separate classes or schools. Though that wouldn't be possible everywhere.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#343

Post by admissionsguy »

michaelbuckbee wrote: post #221
version_five wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m wondering what the odds are that people will pivot from “it’s experimental” to “it was rushed due to politics/greed”. No doubt this will be the case for some. So, you've found a logical flaw in people's stated reasons for not wanting a vaccine. How does that help anything? In these kinds of debates, the actual goals or beliefs of both sides often differ from what they say. For example, the government being able…

I recent came across a technique for having a more substantial discussion and it was to ask: "Well, what would it take for you to change your mind?" Not that this is a silver bullet that automatically leads to peace and harmony, but it's a step in the right direction.

> what would it take for you to change your mind?"

In general terms, I would need the society at large to get off the moral high horse and engage in an honest cost/benefit analysis of all covid measures.

Isn't it hypocritical that people accuse the young not taking the vaccine of being selfish, while hoarding the vaccines away from vulnerable people in poorer parts of the world?

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#344

Post by seriousquestion »

thepasswordis wrote: post #200

People don’t want to take the vaccine because others are trying to force them to. They would say “it’s not FDA approved!” not as the core of their hesitancy, but because they were trying to be appeal to pro-vax peoples decision making framework. I don’t think we should be able to require them to. To many of you here: imagine the Trump admin trying to require you to take the vaccine in November of last year. Cities wo…

You don't even have to imagine. Kamala Harris: "But if Donald Trump tells us to take it, I’m not taking it."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dAjCeMuXR0

The same thing was broadly expressed on twitter at the time too, she was far from alone in that sentiment.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#345

Post by josephorjoe »

frankfrankfrank wrote: post #256
bluGill wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm expecting most fortune 500 companies will now mandate all employees be vaccinated, along with most colleges.

I am curious to see how this goes, because it will also be a clear indicator where our society and civilization is heading if there is no legal recourse against illegitimate authoritarian dictates that simply alter established practices to follow form over function. There is of course also the issue that mandates come with legal liability for consequences that manufacturers are seemingly not liable for. However, when…

serious question: are you a bot?

nice use of the oxford comma btw.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#346

Post by maxerickson »

peakaboo wrote: post #86
acdha wrote: post #6

I’m wondering what the odds are that people will pivot from “it’s experimental” to “it was rushed due to politics/greed”. I think a huge factor will be how many employers, colleges, etc. are now willing and legally able to require vaccination. It’s one thing to say you trust something you read on Facebook more than your doctor and quite another to walk away from a job because of it.

I think you are right. People won't change their minds about it. But the question is, should they be allowed to control what goes inside their bodies? In my opinion, the answer is a huge YES OF COURSE.

It's the implied "with no other impact on their lives" that people actually disagree with.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#347

Post by GenerocUsername »

walls wrote: post #299
mlang23 wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vaccination is still not mandatory, right? Why do you write "excuse"? Are you really so full of yourself that you can not accept that people make different decisions from yours? Why do you even care? I assume you got the vaccine for yourself. So what is the issue? Why do you have to speak about your fellow humans in such a derogatory tone?

> I assume you don't drink and drive yourself. So what is the issue? See how silly that sounds?

It only sounds silly because no one would say that. You cannot change the argument and pretend you won a fight

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#348

Post by rootusrootus »

admissionsguy wrote: post #343
michaelbuckbee wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recent came across a technique for having a more substantial discussion and it was to ask: "Well, what would it take for you to change your mind?" Not that this is a silver bullet that automatically leads to peace and harmony, but it's a step in the right direction.

> what would it take for you to change your mind?" In general terms, I would need the society at large to get off the moral high horse and engage in an honest cost/benefit analysis of all covid measures. Isn't it hypocritical that people accuse the young not taking the vaccine of being selfish, while hoarding the vaccines away from vulnerable people in poorer parts of the world?

> Isn't it hypocritical that people accuse the young not taking the vaccine of being selfish, while hoarding the vaccines away from vulnerable people in poorer parts of the world?

It can only hypocritical if it is the same people making both arguments.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#349

Post by not2b »

michaelbuckbee wrote: post #221
version_five wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m wondering what the odds are that people will pivot from “it’s experimental” to “it was rushed due to politics/greed”. No doubt this will be the case for some. So, you've found a logical flaw in people's stated reasons for not wanting a vaccine. How does that help anything? In these kinds of debates, the actual goals or beliefs of both sides often differ from what they say. For example, the government being able…

I recent came across a technique for having a more substantial discussion and it was to ask: "Well, what would it take for you to change your mind?" Not that this is a silver bullet that automatically leads to peace and harmony, but it's a step in the right direction.

Someone might be holding out for a reason they can't articulate or justify, so they give have an answer to your question (what would it take to change your mind?) but it might not be the true one or the sufficient one.

I hope that this latest change sways some people but I don't think it will be a lot.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#350

Post by mlang23 »

walls wrote: post #299
mlang23 wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vaccination is still not mandatory, right? Why do you write "excuse"? Are you really so full of yourself that you can not accept that people make different decisions from yours? Why do you even care? I assume you got the vaccine for yourself. So what is the issue? Why do you have to speak about your fellow humans in such a derogatory tone?

> I assume you don't drink and drive yourself. So what is the issue? See how silly that sounds?

This is no quote, so please dont make it look like one.

Also, the comparison is nonsense. If someone drinks and drives, they did intake something into their system which made them a risk to others. What you want is the reverse. Everyone is by default a risk to the society, and only if the get a biannual shot from the latest and greatest experimental medicine, you deem them no danger to society. You are trying to outlaw the human condition. There are people who think this is a big deal and needs to be opposed. I agree.

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