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Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

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Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#341

Post by AwaAwa »

avz wrote: post #325
trutannus wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Like, having this magic, absolutely mind boggling potion that prevents serious illness and death isn't already the lottery win of our lifetime A lot of it boils down to people not trusting what they're seeing. Frankly, governments have done the world a disservice by speaking before they really had all the information at the start of the pandemic. In Canada at least an insane amount of what was said turned out to be…

> [...] lots of people see what looks like the "story changing", and distrust anything coming out of their government, [...]. Changing and updating our beliefs as evidence comes in is a fundamental ability that underlies numerous activities from scientific research to debugging software to driving on a congested road network. Why is it a problem for public health officials to update and change policy as we learn more…

Changing your beliefs on the words of your "betters", under pressure, umpteen times is not conducive to trust.

Perhaps if our masters in government had heeded the story of "the boy who cried wolf", then things might have been different.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#342

Post by [deleted] »

baobabKoodaa wrote: post #276
indolering wrote: post #131

I saw the headline and I thought, "Why do I care what Linus has to say about vaccines? He's just a programmer!" But then I clicked the link and realized that it was a classic Linus rant! As much as I support codes of conduct and Linus curtailing his asshole behavior regarding technical matters, I think there should be a loophole for anti-vaxxers and other nut jobs who don't care that they might transmit a deadly dise…

It's a bit disingenuous of you to state that anti-vax people "don't care". Have you actually engaged with any of them? They probably care a lot more than you and me about this stuff, they've just gone to the wrong conclusions. Also, you generally support Linus curtailing his asshole behavior, but you want to make an exception for anti-vax people? Why? You want them to burrow down harder into their anti-science bunker…

[deleted]

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#343

Post by throw7 »

I hate to be a pedant, but covid-19 is the disease. SARS-CoV-2 is the virus. Sure, "Covid-19 virus" is in the vernacular, but when you're fighting misinformation, it doesn't help to then use misnomers.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#344

Post by caeril »

TravelPiglet wrote: post #273
trutannus wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Like, having this magic, absolutely mind boggling potion that prevents serious illness and death isn't already the lottery win of our lifetime A lot of it boils down to people not trusting what they're seeing. Frankly, governments have done the world a disservice by speaking before they really had all the information at the start of the pandemic. In Canada at least an insane amount of what was said turned out to be…

Anti-vaxers would have spread the same thing regardless of government info and prediction rate.

This is certifiably untrue. You should take a look at the "traditional" anti-vaxxers, who are a very small minority, and compare them to the recent ones, who are much, much larger.

The archetype of a current anti-covid-vaxxer is one who had no problem getting their kids vaccinated for polio, for DTAP, the chickenpox, and usually had no hesitation about getting the annual flu shot.

These people are categorically different, and much more numerous, than the tinfoil-hat-vaccines-cause-autism crowd.

One should surmise that the motivations are also categorically different, and I think you'll find if you actually speak to them, that distrust of the enormous governmental and institutional pressure is a significant factor.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#345

Post by hashkb »

krastanov wrote: post #225
hashkb wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were you saying something racist? I'm just asking.

Come on, really!? In a discussion about how trolls use "I am just asking", you decided that doing the same is a good idea. I am not op, but I have been accused of sealioning in the exact opposite direction: I was defending some curriculum based on ideas from critical race theory. Edit: Well, as the comment below alluded to, I probably missed a pretty obvious piece of sarcasm... This is certainly funny in hindsight.

Sorry it wasn't clear. I tried to be as extreme as possible to avoid being taken seriously. (Although I guess these days that works the other way.)

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#346

Post by [deleted] »

avz wrote: post #325
trutannus wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Like, having this magic, absolutely mind boggling potion that prevents serious illness and death isn't already the lottery win of our lifetime A lot of it boils down to people not trusting what they're seeing. Frankly, governments have done the world a disservice by speaking before they really had all the information at the start of the pandemic. In Canada at least an insane amount of what was said turned out to be…

> [...] lots of people see what looks like the "story changing", and distrust anything coming out of their government, [...]. Changing and updating our beliefs as evidence comes in is a fundamental ability that underlies numerous activities from scientific research to debugging software to driving on a congested road network. Why is it a problem for public health officials to update and change policy as we learn more…

[deleted]

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#347

Post by hashkb »

walrus01 wrote: post #233
krastanov wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come on, really!? In a discussion about how trolls use "I am just asking", you decided that doing the same is a good idea. I am not op, but I have been accused of sealioning in the exact opposite direction: I was defending some curriculum based on ideas from critical race theory. Edit: Well, as the comment below alluded to, I probably missed a pretty obvious piece of sarcasm... This is certainly funny in hindsight.

One of the difficult parts of text based debate and discussion is that it's impossible to determine from vocal inflection, tone of voice and method of delivery whether someone is genuinely a fool, simply cosplaying as one, being sarcastic or facetious, etc.

Oh, I'm definitely, genuinely a fool. For ever trying to get a point across on the internet.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#348

Post by AnimalMuppet »

IvyMike wrote: post #310
GPerson wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m having a hard time believing you’ve met worse than a 10:1 ratio, with respect to interest in vaccines, of “bad actors” to “good actors”. Here are some links to polls about American views on vaccines. It seems unlikely you’re running into this ratio without some major biasing factor. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2015/02/09/he... https://www.pewresearch.org/science/2021/03/05/growing-share... (I’l…

There is a major biasing factor; it's trivial to ask a question like "Have you looked at the data in VAERS that shows tens of thousands of adverse vaccine reactions??" It's not so trivial to answer the question in a way that explains how VAERS works, and why this conclusion is incorrect. This is the same with many possible questions. This specific scenario happens on my local Nextdoor groups all the time. I've answer…

> This specific scenario happens on my local Nextdoor groups all the time. I've answered responded with what I think is pretty clear and concise information, and then seem that same person ask the same question the very next day in a new thread. (And the next day, and the next...) I cannot help but conclude they're not really looking for an answer.

Maybe I'm a jerk, but I'd be inclined to answer the second question with "I answered that yesterday. Why do you keep asking if you aren't going to listen to the answers?" And reply with that every single time they re-asked the question.

But... Nextdoor... does that mean it's your physical neighbors? That might make me hesitate to do so. Or maybe I'd still do something like the same, but worded more gently and politely.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#349

Post by avz »

H8crilA wrote: post #140

Just to clear one thing: Vaccines actually do edit the genetic code, but only of some select B-cells. And so does any other antigen that your body develops antibodies for. The process is very complicated and beautiful, and is pretty much exactly the same as in plenty of other multicellular life forms. If you've ever wondered what's the "storage format" for all the recipes for all the different antibodies that your bo…

> the human genome is littered with viral genetic material accumulated over time, god knows if it's for good or for bad

In some cases, we know too, e.g. synctin-1 [1] is a viral protein coded by a gene integrated into the primate germ line some 25 million years ago and repurposed by our bodies to facilitate cell fusion in the development of the placenta.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syncytin-1

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