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Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

reuters.com

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Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#341

Post by Avalaxy »

woeirua wrote: post #184

Everyone should take some time now to learn about Tether, the high likelihood that it is in fact a Ponzi scheme, and that it poses a big systemic risk to the crypto exchanges and therefore the markets themselves [1]. People have been sounding the alarm on Tether for a long time now, but we’re finally getting some hard evidence now to back the allegations [2]. Don’t say you weren’t warned. [1] https://mobile.twitter.c…

As a noob who owns some bitcoin and ethereum (both stored on an exchange), how does tether being a scam (which I do believe in) affect me? I don't hold any tether myself.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#342

Post by sleepybrett »

cheaprentalyeti wrote: post #116
TimJRobinson wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apps like Nicehash mine the most profitable shitcoin using your GPU and convert it to Bitcoin. When the market pumps people buy up cards and use it to make good money.

I'll have to try it on my eight-year old laptop then. Maybe the crash will make it suddenly efficient.

You'll spend more in electricity than you will make.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#343

Post by eingaeKaiy8ujie »

Theodores wrote: post #160
bogota wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can criticize crypto currency’s for a lot but I still have never seen a good argument for it being a ponzi scheme. Can someone further this argument to one that wouldn't cover every investment asset?

Abductive reasoning: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duck_test So you have the non-existent assets, bag holding, difficulty getting out and the promise of above average returns. If I put my money into my saving account then I can get out at a clearly stated time, there is no expectation apart from very little interest and I am reasonably sure that the government will bail out the bank if the bank fails. In between ther…

There are no promises of returns.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#344

Post by Toine »

woeirua wrote: post #184

Everyone should take some time now to learn about Tether, the high likelihood that it is in fact a Ponzi scheme, and that it poses a big systemic risk to the crypto exchanges and therefore the markets themselves [1]. People have been sounding the alarm on Tether for a long time now, but we’re finally getting some hard evidence now to back the allegations [2]. Don’t say you weren’t warned. [1] https://mobile.twitter.c…

All crypto tokens are Ponzi schemes

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#345

Post by IMTDb »

Communitivity wrote: post #321
taylodl wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cryptocurrency market is extremely volatile. This isn't that far from normal. If that's true then cryptocurrency is pretty much worthless to use as currency. A desired property of currency is to not have wild fluctuations in value on a weekly or monthly bases.

Currency is a broad term, like service. Like many broad terms, it is often misused and that leads to the broader meaning. Currency can be used for different things. In one meaning, currency is a tradable and stable store of value. This used to mean it was backed by some recognized valuable commodity, such as gold, but that is no longer the case. In another meaning, currency is a thing that is traded and has an expect…

> Detractors cite electricity usage, but overall it uses much less electricity than the traditional banking system

The traditional banking handles thousands of transfer per seconds, and many many many more assets and assets types than bitcoin. All things that bitcoin is not able - nor designed to - handle.

It's like saying that F1 engine are consuming less gas than trucks. It's only valid if you only look at it from a very specific angle. Sure, in total trucks are consuming more than F1, but both in consumption per km and in versatility, trucks win. F1 engines are not ready - nor designed to - be a suitable replacement for trucks engines.

Bitcoin and cryptos consume order of magnitude more electricity than the traditional banking system if you put them in equal terms. It's only logical since one is supposed to work in zero-trust environments while the other doesn't.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#346

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

Communitivity wrote: post #321
taylodl wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cryptocurrency market is extremely volatile. This isn't that far from normal. If that's true then cryptocurrency is pretty much worthless to use as currency. A desired property of currency is to not have wild fluctuations in value on a weekly or monthly bases.

Currency is a broad term, like service. Like many broad terms, it is often misused and that leads to the broader meaning. Currency can be used for different things. In one meaning, currency is a tradable and stable store of value. This used to mean it was backed by some recognized valuable commodity, such as gold, but that is no longer the case. In another meaning, currency is a thing that is traded and has an expect…

>Currency is a broad term, like service. Like many broad terms, it is often misused and that leads to the broader meaning. Currency can be used for different things.

No? A currency is a medium of exchange for goods and services.

The secondary meaning that you're attempting to allocate to "currency" is already amply described by the word "asset".

The two are not the same, and assets are not meaningfully regarded as proto-currencies in the way you suggest.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#347

Post by matheusmoreira »

almost_usual wrote: post #110
stephc_int13 wrote: post #8

I don't know why, it is probably highly irrational, but I always rejoice when the Bitcoin crashes.

It’s not irrational it’s a step towards not wasting tremendous energy.

It's not even 1% of the world's energy consumption. If you want to stop wasting tremendous amounts of energy, all you have to do is stop trading with China.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#348

Post by Morvan »

hedora wrote: post #320
broighbrobroigh wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tulip bulb mania story is an incredibly persistent but inaccurate myth.

The “debunking” of Tulip Mania has, itself, been thoroughly debunked: https://fee.org/articles/tulip-mania-not-a-myth/ Plenty of financial records still exist from back then. Tulip bulb mania actually happened.

That article doesn't debunk anything lol Goldgar's points are still just as valid.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#349

Post by imtringued »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #306
jmacd wrote: post #11

As an outside observer, who has no crypto holdings at all, but is very deeply invested in the public stock market with a heavy weight on technology stocks... this doesn't look like a crash to me at all. It just looks like some steam being let off and old investors cash out and new investors get more comfortable with how much and where to invest. I consider crypto currency as it is to be an elaborate Ponzi scheme (per…

> I consider crypto currency as it is to be an elaborate Ponzi scheme (personal view) Off topic, but as someone with very little understanding of economics and no stake in cryptocurrency, I don't understand where "legitimate currency" ends and "Ponzi scheme" begins. I get that a Ponzi scheme is one which produces little or no value, and the majority of "earnings" are just wealth redistribution from the bottom of the…

>I don't understand what legitimate value ordinary currency produces.

You can exchange your local government currency for services and goods. With Bitcoin you first have to convert them into a local government currency and then buy services and goods. This only works because those local government currencies exist in the first place. I'll pull this out of nowhere and say that 95% of the value of Bitcoin is derived from government currencies by that I mean the reason Bitcoin is valuable is that you can exchange it for government currencies.

The other 5% are services and products that you can purchase with Bitcoin directly. That portion needs to grow if Bitcoin wants to become a "legitimate currency" but if everyone abuses the currency by hoarding it and doing nothing with it then it might as well not exist.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#350

Post by broighbrobroigh »

BenoitEssiambre wrote: post #66
stephc_int13 wrote: post #8

I don't know why, it is probably highly irrational, but I always rejoice when the Bitcoin crashes.

I mean the technology is highly damaging to society in a whole bunch of ways, damaging the environment, supporting fraud and ransomware, used for money laundering, funding crime, and if it gets integrated into the financial system like some want it to be, it could even destroy human civilization: https://benoitessiambre.com/specter.html (even Douglas Adams tried to warn us 40 years ago). So it's a relief when it look…

It's already integrated into the financial system. I'm sorry you live your life in terror of a poorly supported hyperbolic hypothesis.
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