The Fed now owns nearly 1/3 of all U.S. mortgages • Hacker News Board

Re: The Fed now owns nearly 1/3 of all U.S. mortgages

#341

Post by charlesu » Thu, Sep 10, 2020, 11:22 PM UTC

motorcycleman9 wrote: post #340

charlesu wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing to discuss because you don't really have much of an argument. "Look around. Things are better than what they were" doesn't negate the fact that market forces are bad at distributing resources. You can look at the COVID-19 crisis as well. "Market forces" led to distribution channels with no redundancy, leaving the United States with a shortage of something super basic: PPE.

You continue to state that market forces are bad, while not paying any attention to the counterargument that they are pretty good compared to the alternatives. Making an honest comparison would be a much tedious discussion.

I'm not saying market forces are categorically bad. I'm saying they're bad at some things. Market forces are terrible at distributing housing, healthcare, and primary education. As with most things, there's a happy medium between unfettered market forces and central planning.

Re: The Fed now owns nearly 1/3 of all U.S. mortgages

#342

Post by rrrrrrrrrrrryan » Fri, Sep 11, 2020, 3:29 AM UTC

refurb wrote: post #291

FiReaNG3L wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean, like the previous generation did?

I think you’re romanticizing the prior generation. Sure they could buy a house with a blue collar job, but they weren’t doing that in NYC or other top tier cities and they often lived in much smaller home. Maybe 2bed/1bath 1000 sq ft house for a family of 5. My entire extended family struggled a lot when growing up in the 50-70s. It’s easy to look back at those that lucked out and bought a house in a prime location i…

There are extremes at both sides of the spectrum - Detroit real estate plummeted, San Francisco real estate skyrocketed.

You're right to point out that there isn't one narrative that defines the prior generation. Some people lucked out, others didn't, but the reality is that on average (both median and mean) home prices have drastically outpaced wage growth for the past few decades, which is obviously unsustainable.

The best the younger generations can hope for is to eventually have enough wage growth to afford a home that hopefully holds its value.

Re: The Fed now owns nearly 1/3 of all U.S. mortgages

#343

Post by RhysU » Fri, Sep 11, 2020, 10:22 AM UTC

paulgb wrote: post #265

RhysU wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source for claim?

This claim? > the Overton window now includes completely eliminating student debt. I'm referring to the fact that Bernie Sanders, who came close to being a major party candidate, ran on canceling student debt.

Wikipedia says "According to Overton, the window frames the range of policies that a politician can recommend without appearing too extreme to gain or keep public office given the climate of public opinion at that time."

Bernie certainly did not gain new public office in 2020. I therefore think Bernie's primary run does not demonstrate the window's shift on canceling student debt across America. Sure, he came closer in 2020 but no cigar.

So long as Bernie keeps his Senate seat, I agree that the Overton window in Vermont now includes cancelling student debt. We won't know for certain unless he is reelected there.

Re: The Fed now owns nearly 1/3 of all U.S. mortgages

#344

Post by glenstein » Fri, Sep 11, 2020, 2:33 PM UTC

tialaramex wrote: post #333

glenstein wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>No. Real property doesn't work that way at all. I carefully read through the rest of the comment after this sentence, waiting for the support for this claim, and feel as though I came away emptyhanded. I get that the shareholders anecdote is supposed to support it, but that came off as really fuzzy and unclear, and not something that directly engaged with my question. Are you saying there are no new buyers? Do you h…

The rest of the comment isn't support for the claim that real property isn't like this - instead it assumes you've been shaken awake by the realisation that oh, these aren't toasters or smartphones, they're homes, and thus real property, and so the usual free market hand waving doesn't apply at all. But if it wasn't clear I'll explain. The reason real property isn't like this ought to be entirely obvious at a very hi…

You know, I actually thought you knew what you were talking about and were going to have something thoughtful to say. To answer directly: nope, this does not help at all. I was expecting something like a discussion of, I don't know, pertinent micro or macroeconomic forces, maybe something about elasticity as applied to housing, or citation of some article illustrating how a change in financing in one region had a measurable impact on prices and the number of buyers, or something of that nature.

Instead you are condescendingly lecturing me about the shape of the earth, and telling me the rest of it is so obvious you can't bother explaining it. But even I know we haven't run up against absolute geographical limits, and to to the extent that the shape of the earth is an influence, it one among many, in a process that is also mediated by additional influences, as well: constraints of availability of housing already built, the rate of new construction, changes in financing, population growth, people's savings, changes in how many people choose to stay at home, etc. I was waiting for some economically literate discussion of those kinds of elements.

Re: The Fed now owns nearly 1/3 of all U.S. mortgages

#345

Post by macca321 » Fri, Sep 11, 2020, 6:47 PM UTC

CydeWeys wrote: post #161

postingawayonhn wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For example, FHA offering 5% down payments instead of a standard 20%, just means every first time buyer can now pay 15% more (approximately) for a house. Assuming they had the same deposit available they would theoretically be able to pay 300% more. Of course they probably wouldn't be able to demonstrate their ability to service a loan that large.

They're not gonna pay 300% because they wouldn't be able to pay even the first monthly mortgage payment. Buyers aren't stupid -- they'll take advantage of low money down but they won't get themselves into a mortgage that they literally already can't afford the payment on from day one. No, the way mortgage problems typically happen is that the payments are initially affordable but then something changes (typically job…

Mortgage repayments are much cheaper than renting, at least where I am in London

Re: The Fed now owns nearly 1/3 of all U.S. mortgages

#346

Post by rocqua » Fri, Sep 11, 2020, 9:56 PM UTC

vonmoltke wrote: post #127

rocqua wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to make student loans more accessible, the trick is not to stimulate student loans be legalizing the loan-sharking of students. This way you are just encouraging students to take a bad deal. You are making the system more accessible by offering really bad options. If the reasoning is "It is a good idea to have high education", then stimulate that directly. At the very least, have government-backed or gove…

> In my country (the Netherlands), student loans are given by the government. Over 90% of American student loans are also issued by the federal government.

hmmm, I did not know this. What are the terms offered?