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Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

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Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#341

Post by Spooky23 »

ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

Perhaps you should take pause and reflect on the broader issue Gates is talking about.

Social media is destroying our society in front of our eyes. Identifying how and why that is happening is something that matters too. The hardline techie position that all communications must be completely encrypted with obfuscated origins is a position whose consequences are not fully understood.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#342

Post by ffggvv »

lordofgibbons wrote: post #95

>And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger]. WOW. Why would someone in the tech industry like Gates be anti-encryption for the public? The only argument I can think of against it is "You have nothing to worry about if you ha…

he said it right there. he thinks child trafficking and misinformation outweigh privacy. i disagree with him but no reason to concoct an argument when there’s one there

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#343

Post by Spooky23 »

dharma1 wrote: post #258

I would love to see someone let Bill talk about covid, the implications of economic damage and increased debt over the next 1-2 years, the inequality which covid magnifies, and future methods of prevention - for an hour or two, with a good host. This interview is good but barely scratches the surface. edit: I've just found a recent interview - while still high level, it's a bit more detailed. However, the comments se…

It isn’t a thing. What is a thing is destabilizing entities using social platforms to advance their agenda.

Once you light that spark, the useful idiots will help advance that agenda.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#344

Post by refurb »

pteraspidomorph wrote: post #338
refurb wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He makes the statement "most of the tests are crap". That seems like a technical question to me.

He was talking about the performance of the procedure as a whole. He's saying most tests are unacceptably slow in the US because the labs doing the testing aren't paid less for being slow, so they take in more customers than they can handle reliably.

Actually, he blames reimbursement and has this to say "Because the federal government sets that reimbursement system."

That is not an accurate statement. Yes, the government sets reimbursement for Medicare and Medicaid, but not for private insurance which is ~60% of Americans.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#345

Post by [deleted] »

ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

[deleted]

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#346

Post by Canada »

reillyse wrote: post #109
ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

I don't think he is saying that encrypted communication should be illegal. He's saying that spreading lies through encrypted channels should be stopped. It would not be hard for WhatsApp to prevent people from spreading bogus videos, because they have access to the unencrypted information before and after sending. So either preventing people from sharing misinformation or preventing people from reading the misinforma…

The main purpose of E2EE communication between willing participants is that the content of the communication is not checked, inspected, scanned, questioned, sampled, matched, filtered, modified, blocked, altered, or otherwise interfered with in any way whatsoever except that which is explicitly configured and consented to by a party to the conversation. (eg. anti-virus, anti-spam, group membership, etc)

That means no control of communication by the endpoint software either directly or indirectly between willing senders and recipients regardless of justification, and especially on the basis of whether or not data send from a willing sender to a willing receipient represents the "truth". The endpoint software vendor has no standing to judge that unless it's an opt-in anti-spam type feature.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#347

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

"As someone who has built your life on science and logic, I'm curious what you think when you see so many people signing onto this anti-science view of the world.

Well, strangely, I'm involved in almost everything that anti-science is fighting. I'm involved with climate change, GMOs, and vaccines. The IRONY [emphasis added] is that it's DIGITAL [emphasis added] social media that allows this kind of titillating, oversimplistic explanation of, "OK, there's just an evil person, and that explains all of this."

Well, you're friends with Mark Zuckerberg. Have you talked to him about this?

After I said this publicly, he sent me mail. I like Mark, I think he's got very good values, but he and I do disagree on the trade-offs involved there. The lies are so titillating you have to be able to see them and at least slow them down."

Gates has a reason to be against the spreading of information on social media because recently he became a target of conspiracy theories spread on social media.

If encryption is an imediment to stoping people from spreading theories about him, then he obviously has a reason to be against encryption when used to spread these theories.

Maybe what is more interesting is when he uses the word irony right before he states he is against encryption.

What does he mean?

What is ironic about the fact that it is "digital social media" that allows "oversimplistic explanation[s]"?

HN readers can probably make better guesses than me. Disgreement with the guesses I make is expected.

For example, perhaps it is ironic because:

He has been such a strong proponent of using computers for anything and everything.

Gates was initially a skeptic of the internet, but later believed Microsoft's "internet strategy" was of primary importance. This led to projects like Internet Explorer and MSN. The company is now preparing to spend billions to acquire a social media company.

In amassing the fortune that allows him to pursue these philanthropic causes he and his company presented countless titillating, oversimplistic explanations of the value of using computers for seemingly anything. He wanted us to believe that the computer (running Windows of course) was the great enabler.

I have no idea what he meant and I am grasping at straws.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#348

Post by WarOnPrivacy »

therealdrag0 wrote: post #323
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well they are currently able to scan media and maintain a fingerprint database of illegal content. If it’s encrypted this is not possible right? That’s a serious trade off. No more a trade off than the existence of the internet or computers - which are wholly implicated in encouraging a far worse behavior than the transport of illegal porn. They facilitate it's creation. In this, we have an even more serious trade…

I mean it was created before internet/computers but sure. I don’t see your point though as we can and do scan media to combat that creation, without nuking the internet... Without the ability to scan, the battle seems seriously kneecapped. If currently reported counts from automation in the US are in the order of magnitude of 100 million (I forget exact numbers, but it was near this) from a small number of companies,…

>I mean it was created before internet/computers but sure.

My point was that the creation rate of illegal porn exploded because of computers. Your above statement seems dismissive of that.

>we can and do scan media to combat that creation, without nuking the internet. Without the ability to scan, the battle seems seriously kneecapped.

It isn't and hasn't been. Large tech companies intercept and report billions of images to LEO regularly, which are largely captured before and after transport.

Meanwhile, actual police work is what leads police to people who harm children - the importance of which is being increasingly eclipsed by the obsession with safe encryption.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#349

Post by bobsil1 »

ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

Those dependent on federal gov biz cannot afford to openly oppose fed talking points (MS, SpaceX, telecoms).

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#350

Post by roenxi »

solarhoma wrote: post #215
tptacek wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's frustrating about this question is that it (inevitably!) commands the top of the HN thread with a discussion of the least interesting thing in the article. It's an article about COVID and Facebook, and here we're recapitulating the end-to-end encryption debate for the 8-zillionth time.

I would argue that this statement from Bill is the most interesting. This statement shows Bill Gates, someone who has influence on legislatures, making a statement against encryption.

Everyone has a range of opinions and some of them will be factually/morally/logically/practically objectionable. The fact that Gates has an opinion that you, I or indeed everyone disagrees with is not interesting.

What about "It’s insane how confused the trials here in the US have been."? That opinion is very important and has implications for how everyone here should act. The last 6 months have been expensively purchased and the best thing that could have been bought was good information. If that time has been wasted then there should be reform of an evidence-based nature. This is an opinion that really deserves debate, opinions thrown about and evidence dredged up. With encryption, HN will basically just agree that he is wrong and everyone likes encryption. Not much more to say. Maybe we will think of the children on the way thorough.

Encryption is an important issue but frankly that isn't what Gates is talking about, so arguing about it is a bit pointless. It is barely even germain to the topic he is talking about. He is talking about a global pandemic.

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