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Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

theverge.com

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Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#341

Post by eganist »

gojomo wrote: post #330
bryant wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I think you're missing what happened. > Google’s private app was designed to monitor how people use their iPhones, similar to Facebook’s research app. Googling this, I don't see references to 1099, W2, or Corp to Corp contracts which might help anyone say it's "internal." Paying someone for a service does not make them a part of internal operations of a company. It's this Screenwise Meter app which got the cert…

I know that's the fuzzy reasoning that's being reported. But the actual terms of Apple's agreement seem to allow "Permitted Users" who are "contractors". Contractors aren't just those issued 1099's: it's anyone "under contract". If the mechanism for bringing participants into "Screenwise Meter" involved a contracted payment, it plausibly matches some of the expressly permitted uses, in the Apple Enterprise terms. (If…

Kids as young as 13 were sought for this.

They can't sign a contract. They can't become contractors.

Why do you keep fighting this? It doesn't even seem like devil's advocate anymore. :/

---

it's anyone "under contract".

It's not. I'm not an employment lawyer, but that's definitely not true. At all. Under any circumstances.

If you need help with it, check this: https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-a-vendo...

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#342

Post by rootusrootus »

mcmoose75 wrote: post #290
askafriend wrote: post #43

Let’s say you’re using a Google API like Maps, and you violate terms by snapshotting sections of their maps and storing them on your severs so you can serve static maps without making API calls. They’d shut down your API access immediately Google and Facebook both knew the terms. They both knew that the Enterprise Distribution Program was for internal use only. They still put ads out in the wild to recruit regular co…

I agree that Google & FB violated the terms of the agreement they had with Apple. I think an interesting question is: What is Apple's best move from here? I would suggest that Apple should leave Google/ FB blocked for ~1-2 weeks, to remind them who's boss on the iOS platform. However, I would argue it'd be smart for them to switch them back on after that- there's a chance that this looks anticompetitive to regulators…

I imagine they're going to have a pow-wow with Google/FB execs and/or legal where they will all agree that the rules really are the rules and Google/FB will promise not to break them again, and Apple will restore the certs. Probably in less than a week. Apple has made their point, and there are good reasons to maintain a cordial relationship.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#343

Post by 51lver »

blhack wrote: post #214
askafriend wrote: post #43

Let’s say you’re using a Google API like Maps, and you violate terms by snapshotting sections of their maps and storing them on your severs so you can serve static maps without making API calls. They’d shut down your API access immediately Google and Facebook both knew the terms. They both knew that the Enterprise Distribution Program was for internal use only. They still put ads out in the wild to recruit regular co…

Because lots of people still think that if you own a piece of hardware, you should be able to run whatever code you want on it.

You're not wrong, you're just in the wrong place. Apple is the sysadmin and the phone holders are the users. They WANT apple looking out for them. Anyone who says otherwise stupidly wasted $1000 when they could have bought any number of unlockable devices for that money.

I say this with an unlocked and de-googled android phone next to me, and several hacked arm devices at home. I OWN THEM, with no doubt, so I agree with you in a different world.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#344

Post by cortesoft »

kccqzy wrote: post #67
_bxg1 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to feel that way, and I used Android for years for that reason. But since switching to an iPhone, I've found that what I really want from my phone is not a totally open platform, but a tool that's simple, secure, and effective. Something I don't have to mess with, something I can trust to do its job and respect my privacy and be pleasant to interact with. They tried going that direction a bit with macOS when t…

Honestly that's my feeling as well, but even for workstations, it has begun to dawn on me that spending time configuring the minutiae of various settings and flags and plists etc just isn't worth my time. I just want a workstation that's simple, secure, and effective in getting things done.

Those are fine defaults, but why is it bad to allow people to explicitly opt out of this and do what they want? Other people being allowed to hack on their machine doesn't stop yours from being locked down.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#345

Post by [deleted] »

stevenjohns wrote: post #47

Extremely happy with my decision to get an iPhone. Events like these are what is going to keep me as a customer moving forward, too. I unplugged[0] from Google Last year - went DDG for search, went to iOS, dropped gmail for fastmail, etc. As time goes on I’m continually reaffirmed that I made the right decisions. [0] I still use some Google services, like YouTube, frequently, some of my mail still goes through Gmail,…

[deleted]

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#346

Post by _bxg1 »

johnsea wrote: post #103
_bxg1 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I read that article. It was a pretty bad take. Apple isn't "Thanos-snapping", it's enforcing its own terms of use which are very clearly laid out. Both Facebook and Google knowingly breached those terms, and they got caught. That's all there is to it.

Apple should not have the right to enforce those conditions to begin with. Same as they should not be allowed to kick out apps from their whole platform on a whim. Inacceptable. Such a company should not be allowed to do business in EU. Much worse than what happened with Microsoft in the 90ties.

Microsoft was a monopoly. Apple has a very strong competitor. That's the difference.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#347

Post by afterburner »

jdietrich wrote: post #90
_bxg1 wrote: post #3

I feel less vengeful satisfaction from this one, but I respect that they're applying their rules consistently. I just hope it doesn't backfire. On a totally personal level, I'd rather Facebook feel the hurt for its audacity than Apple be forced to backtrack because they made too many enemies.

It's worth bearing in mind that Google pay Apple billions of dollars a year to be the default search engine on iOS. To my eyes, Apple clearly have the upper hand in this relationship. https://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/3063669/google-is-...

Doesn't seem that clear to me who has the upper hand. Maybe Apple likes getting those billions? What if Google doesn't mind losing it's primo spot on Safari?

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#348

Post by ken »

ce4 wrote: post #283
blhack wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because lots of people still think that if you own a piece of hardware, you should be able to run whatever code you want on it.

To downvoters: That point is valid. It's the golden cage that allowed them to do of course good things this time. This argument is the old one against a walled garden and it still stands.

The point may be valid, but it's not what this discussion is about. Apple didn't cut off a user for running unauthorized software on their iPhone. They cut off Google for using a paid enterprise service to distribute their software in violation of its TOS.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#349

Post by GranPC »

seanalltogether wrote: post #172
askafriend wrote: post #43

Let’s say you’re using a Google API like Maps, and you violate terms by snapshotting sections of their maps and storing them on your severs so you can serve static maps without making API calls. They’d shut down your API access immediately Google and Facebook both knew the terms. They both knew that the Enterprise Distribution Program was for internal use only. They still put ads out in the wild to recruit regular co…

Would you be ok if Google blacklisted your domain in the Chrome browser for violating those mapping API terms?

No, because it wasn't a violation of the Chrome ToS.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#350

Post by vilhelm_s »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #284
GeekyBear wrote: post #237

Google immediately admitted that they were aware that what they had done violated those terms. >A Google spokesperson told The Verge, “The Screenwise Meter iOS app should not have operated under Apple’s developer enterprise program — this was a mistake, and we apologize. https://www.theverge.com/2019/1/30/18204064/apple-google-mon...

And so they should be fully understanding why Apple enforced them. Furthermore, the terrifying level of abuse of the Screenwise program has been going on a really, really long time: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/02/google-paying-users-... It's hard to tell exactly how long the iOS app has been available, but I found version 7.x of the Android app all the way back in 2015 on APKmirror (it's archive only goes ba…

How is that "terribly abusive"? People are getting paid to participate, to me that seems like a higher level of informed consent and more ethical than other forms of user tracking.
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