DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps • Hacker News Board

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#341

Post by macintux » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:23 AM UTC

itwasntandy wrote: post #275

ams6110 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Privacy aside, Apple maps, in my experience, are definitely worse than Google in terms of actually corresponding to reality. Apple Maps navigation also takes me on convoluted routes far more often than Google does.

My own experience ( North east US) has been somewhat different recently. Yes routes from Apple maps, may appear longer or more convoluted at first glance. However after using it ( due to CarPlay) for a while on routes I had previously regularly done using google maps, I inferred a reasoning for that. On the ~90 minute journey to my in-laws, the predicted journey time, is generally advertised as being quicker on googl…

I can’t speak to left turns, but someone attempted a careful evaluation of the turn-by-turn options and Apple’s estimates were generally more conservative, leading to the conclusion that you point out, that Apple looked slower but wasn’t.

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#342

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:25 AM UTC

andrepd wrote: post #338

tyingq wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brin and Page pretty much say it's inevitable that a commerical search engine will succumb to "evil". The only solution they present is an academic/non-profit run search engine. http://infolab.stanford.edu/~backrub/google.html (scroll down to "Appendix A: Advertising and Mixed Motives")

The owners of a commercial search engine say that it's inevitable that a commercial search engine will succumb to evil. Hmmm.

[deleted]

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#343

Post by Krasnol » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:34 AM UTC

amdelamar wrote: post #320

Krasnol wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it just me or does the map-link go to yelp.com? Why are we even talking about Apple here when it's yelp getting the clicks? This is terrible...

Apple Maps on iOS/macOS shows Yelp photos and reviews of places.

Yeah, but this is not iOS exclusive.

This is affecting everybody using DDG.

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#344

Post by bduerst » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:35 AM UTC

saagarjha wrote: post #323

bduerst wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your messages are stored on iCloud, right?

Only if you enable this feature.

Its enabled by default. iCloud backups are automatically opted in since iOS 9.

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#345

Post by dcow » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:36 AM UTC

The experience is already better. Thank you. Now please delete Yelp (or at least let me turn it off).

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#346

Post by kllrnohj » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:38 AM UTC

setr wrote: post #260

latexr wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sure duckduckgo is a good company right now, but that's only because they're small. Only because they are small? That seems to imply that if they ever get big, they’ll no doubt become evil, privacy-wise. Apple proves that does not have to be the case.

Apple’s main business is hardware, and software that helps sell the hardware. Any revenue from data is likely a seperate, minor stream; and for it to become a significant one, likely requires significant changes in Apple’s operations. Like any other hardware company, they don’t need google’s kind of data collection to make money. But DDG is primarily funded by search, and the search business is funded by ads, which a…

Apple collects and uses data all the time. Their marketing kind of claims they don't, but their privacy policy is very clear that they do.

For example they continuously collect GPS position + list of WiFi APs from iPhone users to build their crowd-source'd wifi location database: "To provide location-based services on Apple products, Apple and our partners and licensees may collect, use, and share precise location data, including the real-time geographic location of your Apple computer or device. Where available, location-based services may use GPS, Bluetooth, and your IP Address, along with crowd-sourced Wi-Fi hotspot and cell tower locations, and other technologies to determine your devices’ approximate location."

They also state: "We also use personal information to help us create, develop, operate, deliver, and improve our products, services, content and advertising, and for loss prevention and anti-fraud purposes."

It's quite eye opening to compare how Apple's marketing describes their privacy policy vs. how Apple's legal describes it.

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#347

Post by saagarjha » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:48 AM UTC

bduerst wrote: post #344

saagarjha wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if you enable this feature.

Its enabled by default. iCloud backups are automatically opted in since iOS 9.

Backing up messages to iCloud is not on by default. iPhone will ask you if you want to enable it.

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#348

Post by thekyle » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:49 AM UTC

zbruhnke wrote: post #49

I really wish DDG would build a Google Apps competitor ... as long as gmail dominates email and business email the privacy argument is largely irrelevant because people will spend hours per day logged in and locked in to the Google ecosystem

For a while, DDG offered a free Jabber provider which lots of people hoped would do to XMPP what Gmail did to Email but they shut it down.

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#349

Post by mlindner » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:50 AM UTC

bduerst wrote: post #201

SEJeff wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That and from a purely data privacy angle, Apple is legitimately better than Google.

How so? Apple shared all their iCloud user data (messages, pics, docs, etc.) and keys with the Chinese government last year. [1] Apple even updated their TOS forcing Chinese users to agree to it or drop service. [2] Google got flak for just considering it with Dragonfly, but Apple actually did it . [1] https://mashable.com/article/china-government-apple-icloud-d... [2] https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-apple-i…

This is constantly being misreported. No. They. Do. Not. Apple's data is kept on the device and so are the keys. If you enable that data to be put on the cloud (it's an opt-in) then they will also store the key, but otherwise they do not.

Re: DuckDuckGo will use Apple Maps

#350

Post by zepto » Wed, Jan 16, 2019, 2:56 AM UTC

bduerst wrote: post #313

thinkloop wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boycotting of countries or not is one thing. Once in a country and following the law, Apple's business model is simply more conducive to privacy. Unlike Google, they are not reliant on the collection and analysis of data. On the contrary, like DDG, they use privacy as a differentiator and advantage. The only thing you can trust about companies is their business models.

If you just cherry pick actions and ignore things such as sharing millions of their users' data with a surveillance state, then sure, they seem privacy focused.

There is a huge difference between complying with a state’s requirements and relying on privacy violation for your business model.