Live data from Hacker News

European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

bbc.com

341–350 of 407 posts

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#341
post #281

Can we just block Europe? Like, partition the internet or something... /s

This is likely what's gonna happen if these bills get passed. The Chinese GFW has created a "Chinternet" already, which not only blocks access to Google, Facebook, etc., but also throttles the bandwidth going out of China down to 1990s dial-up modem speed. The EU is not authoritarian but I suspect that EU regulators may do the same to block US websites that do not comply with their copyright laws in the future.

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#342
post #34

This is what happens when those in control don't understand, know or care about the things they regulate. So I guess this is bad. --goes and reads article-- > Article 11, requiring online platforms to pay publishers a fee if they link to their news content, was also approved. What the fucking FUCK? Pay to send companies actual traffic? Pay to be allowed to use the basic building-block of the world wide web on the wor…

The law was basically made at the publisher’s behest to get Google to pay them. So far, it has spectularly backfired. In Germany, Google started to delist news sites from their index. After traffic dropped, the publishers gave Google a license to link freely. Law defeated. In Spain, they went a bit further and wrote into the law that Google had to list news sites in their index. So Google News shut down in Spain. Law…

No

Law is not defeated.

It means that Google, due to its market power, got the clips for free. Everyone else might be asked to pay.

It's actually anticompetitive.

I totally understand the intention behind it - you see what the death of good media and rise of clickbait/shill articles did to US and UK. The other EU governments are terrified their own information landscape might go similarly downhill - and all you have left is spam, lies, propaganda and corporate ads hidden as articles.

It's just that the approach taken here is the wrong one. They are trying to fix something but shoot at the symptoms, not the cause.

It's also true that Google is exploitative in how it uses its ad + News Power (Look at the content preloader discussion) so clearly it's not aiming at the innocent. It's just not the right tool for the job. Probably because so far no one has figured out how to fix this...

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment is profoundly ignorant. You're dismissing her philosophy because of two descriptive words (and not even the best two, which would probably be "rational selfishness"), which you have decided are the "opposite of good" simply because history says they are? That's just an appeal to tradition: plenty of people have been wrong about plenty of things throughout history, especially in the areas of morality and…

Yes this happens to not be one of those cases, espousing the virtues of selfishness isn’t up for debate anymore. It’s wrong, and has been shown to be so time and time again. To have to rehash such foolishness is pointless.

There is absolutely merit to discussing ideas that you disagree with. And in particular to this context, I personally found lots of value in Atlas Shrugged. Often it lead to me disagree with her philosophy. If anything, reading things that you disagree with allows you to intelligently refute claims instead of vaguely claiming that someone is incorrect and refusing to engage. That is a sure fire way to make people dig into their beliefs.

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because her entire “philosophy” is egotistical selfishness, in her own words. So the opposite of good and profoundly ignorant. No point in rehashing 1000 year old debates that were settled long ago on this type of behavior.

This comment is profoundly ignorant. You're dismissing her philosophy because of two descriptive words (and not even the best two, which would probably be "rational selfishness"), which you have decided are the "opposite of good" simply because history says they are? That's just an appeal to tradition: plenty of people have been wrong about plenty of things throughout history, especially in the areas of morality and…

Philosophy is too kind a word. If I invent a new kind of math which encapsulates obvious stuff like addition,subtraction and multiplication before going off the rails and spewing nonsense the fact that I reiterated arithmetic isn't much of a point in my favor.

She was born to wealth she didn't earn and saw the confiscation of such when the communists took over Russia.

She forever thereafter decried all taxation for the common good not seeing a substantive distinction between the communists taking all her families shit and a democratically elected government taxing to pay for hospitals and roads.

Her ideal man was a criminal to kidnapped a little girl, extorted her father for money, then took the money and ditched the little girls dismembered body and took the money and ran because he refused to live by societies rules.

She gushed over him before dying dependent upon the social security she didn't want anyone else to have.

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> GDPR is a good example of another law which is potentially dangerous. However, I do see that it's hard to comply with both, but I don't see how they interact with other. The copyright law requires you to store metadata about the user who publish content forever while GDPR forbids you to do so. > Why? I would say most of HN leans left not libertarian.

Libertarian doesn't mean "right-wing", it just was co-opted as such, in fact there are many left-wing libertarians.

Many as in 2%?

There are certainly some ideas of merit but supporting politicians that push it seems to inevitably involve benefiting the right who is pushing for many agendas that will personally damage me and mine so I cannot in good conscience do so.

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#346
post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being that her friend and apprentice was Alan Greenspan you can see where people get a little weird about rand. Also the rand think tank that spews serious amounts of fascist policy.

> the rand think tank that spews serious amounts of fascist policy. Like so many ideologies, the fan club is what most people dislike. If you are capable of taking Rands philosophies with a grain of salt, there are many brilliant concepts to glean.

"If you are capable of taking Rands philosophies with a grain of salt, there are many brilliant concepts to glean."

Such as?

Minitel:It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest. --Adam Smith

Except in practice societies require self interest and benevolence and structures designed to promote the latter in order that we can all enjoy the fruits of our respective labor in a functional society.

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#347
post #107

As a EU citizen I have always been (and still am) a strong advocate for the European Union. I think the founding of the European Union was one of the greatest things that could ever happen to European citizens. I full heartedly believe this institution played a major role in retaining the piece after World War 2. The concept of open borders in (most of) Europe is something I would never want to miss. But seeing the l…

It's a bit more complex. The EU produces a huge amount of legislation, but you only hear about the most weird/funny/outrageous one.

Most things go through smoothly because they are so technical or orln topics that no one cares. Then once in a while you have this kind which is in some ways a big progress. Look at the education provisions in there. But here's how the EU works: the Commission (civil service) proposes a draft text. The parliament debates and changes it (mostly along national and political party group lines). The council (national governments) debate and change the same.commissiom proposal. Them council and parliament beat themselves over the head (with commission mediation and proposals on how to find common ground) until they find common ground on drafting that everyone can accept.

Note, not one thing that everyone likes, but one that everyone can accept. Despite the bullshit you might read in UK media or the claims of tyrants like Orban who claim they fought (in their xitizens:against' interest, of course) other governments over this or that, it basically never happens that something is decided at EU level that one (or several) countries strongly disagree with. So you get this kind of pieces in each legislative document - with some bites for everyone and lots of things that have as their sole virtue that no one really hates them that much. Often no one even really understands each part in detail It's similar across the world (see the literally thousands of pages a legislation like Dodd-Frank in the US context can become) - the democratic process is messy; at EU level it's additionally messy because there are 28 national interests at stake and at play.

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if any of these people have received campaign funding from entrenched industries that benefit from draconian copyright laws? Having said that, GDPR has actually turned out to be a very well thought through piece of legislation - I actually agree with it's premises largely and the fact we can't take a database dump anymore and have full access to people's personal details is an extremely good thing IMO. How F…

> I wonder if any of these people have received campaign funding from entrenched industries that benefit from draconian copyright laws? Yes. https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20180531/00285739946/eu-pa...

Wouldn't the "link tax" have a detrimental effect on a site's Pagerank? Lets say someone writes a blogpost on site X and links to site Y, now site Y wants you to pay them for the privilege of linking to them. The blogger might just decide not to link (or save the hassle and not even ask whether they can link without paying). Over time site Y's incoming links drops as nobody is willing to link to it anymore.

Good luck with SEO under such rules, in fact it would be nice if Google then offered an easy way to filter out all the sites that require paying to link to them.

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#349
post #252
post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are quite a few similar rights. One example is that radio stations don't have enter agreements with individual rights owners to license songs. There is blanket fee. Similar payments are for playing music in bars, restaurants and other public spaces, for copying machines, blank CDs (and video and cassette tape), etc. All of those fees are set to collect money, not to kill of that use. The difference this time, i…

>One example is that radio stations don't have enter agreements with individual rights owners to license songs. Isn't that because the music creator already entered an agreement with a rights organization? If the music creator didn't enter an agreement with a rights organization, the station would have to directly enter an agreement with the musician. The musician has the power to decide whether to sign with the orga…

At least in Finland, the state-sanctioned music copyright organization has a legal authority to sell performance permissions to all of the music in the world. Maybe someone in South America wrote a song, and that person has never even heard of Finland. But if you want to perform that song in Finland, you can buy the permit from the Finnish organization.

Re: European parliament committee approves vote on ‘disastrous’ copyright bill

#350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not just use URL shortener outside of EU?

Would you fund the lawsuits they'll get?

If the link shortener is operated by an entity outside the EU is it still subject to EU law?
Post reply on HN