Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’ • Hacker News Board

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#341

Post by dang » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:36 PM UTC

enraged_camel wrote: post #261

tomsthumb wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, I have seen a coworker strongly imply that someone is a white nationalist for suggesting that it’s possible to be a non-racist republican.

One can be a non-racist conservative, in the sense of wanting a smaller government and less regulation. However, today’s Republican Party is undeniably racist, and supporting them also makes one racist in my opinion. This is especially true since today’s Republican Party is not actually conservative. One cannot want smaller government while simultaneously supporting a drastic increase in immigration and border securi…

Please keep standard political talking points off HN. If you repeat something stock, it will get stock responses. That makes it off-topic on a site dedicated to curiosity.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#342

Post by birken » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:36 PM UTC

manfredo wrote: post #233

_skel wrote: post #169

I don't get it. I grew up in Silicon Valley and I work in tech, and so do many other people I know. They run the gamut from far-left socialists to libertarians to own a bunch of guns. They have all kinds of ethnic backgrounds and religious views. Some of my most libertarian/pro-gun friends have not been shy about their political views and it hasn't hurt their tech careers at all. They are far more welcome here than l…

I work in the Bay Area and I have personally worked with (as in, on the same team with and working directly in cooperation. CEOs, founders, etc. are not included in this count), exactly one person who discussed their conservative views. This is in comparison to hundreds of liberals. Sure, you may be able to identify at least one person on variety of ends of the political spectrum, but I don't think anyone can sanely…

Just to counter this anecdata, the startup I used to work at was founded by 4 conservatives, 2 of whom met working in the George W Bush White House. We used to discuss and debate all sorts of politic topics, and in fact I was quite often in the minority (a position that didn't bother me... it was a good way to learn different perspective on some key issues). They were then and I'm sure still now are quite openly conservative and happy to debate politics (in appropriate settings). They didn't hide it publicly either, for example in the early days of the 2016 presidential election they had Jeb Bush come over and give a talk. Jeb was made fun of quite a bit for the manner in which he put on the company swag [1].

The company has raised hundreds of millions of dollars and has hundreds of employees. In my experience I didn't notice a single situation in which their conservative views had negative impacts on the company. In fact I think their conservative background helped the company raise money from VCs, who I'd wager are more conservative than average.

1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBg6hU5zXDA

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#343

Post by anigbrowl » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:38 PM UTC

pfarnsworth wrote: post #149

sho wrote: post #46

What is crazy about the the situation in SF is that even 5 or so years ago if you asked me what the "echo chamber" there was echoing I would have said libertarianism and some kind of techno-utopianism. The takeover by the proscriptive far-left has been astonishingly rapid, and it is absolutely real. I also know people who have left, and many more who absolutely keep their political and even philosophical views to the…

10-12 years ago, there was no tech in SF. Zero. It was mainly financial companies or workers for Levi's, Gap, etc. All the best tech companies were in South Bay. It was Twitter, Zynga, Yelp and quickly followed by Uber, Airbnb, and all the other cool startups that brought tech into SF and probably the cause of that shift. SF started giving tax breaks to tech companies in the late aughts, and then it started the huge…

Having been here since the dot com boom in the 1990s I have to disagree. Large firms headquartering in SF is a relatively new thing, but there were plenty of small firms attracted by VC money but which didn't come out of the Stanford orbit that has shaped SV.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#344

Post by dang » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:38 PM UTC

exogeny wrote: post #18

nodesocket wrote: post #15

I recently moved (fled) from downtown San Francisco to Nashville TN and couldn't be happier. I lived in SF for over 5 years, and there is absolutely a mass exodus of people and engineers leaving the bay area because of extreme ideology, hypocrisy, constant outrage, and the echo chamber that engulfs everything. Downtown San Francisco is a great place to visit for a few days but no place to start and raise a family.

So, because you and a couple of people who share similar viewpoints left, that constitutes a "exodius" (sic)? I'd like for you to read up on confirmation biases, and then post again.

Please don't do internet flame tropes on HN.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#345

Post by leshow » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:38 PM UTC

twblalock wrote: post #203

downandout wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If he can't take the heat he should stay out of the kitchen. I think that's the whole point though. The article is saying that there is too much heat simply because they express their opposing viewpoints. "Stay out of the kitchen" means "close your mouth around Silicon Valley liberals" or you'll experience backlash. While this may not be your personal experience, the article essentially says that the somewhat ironic…

> "Stay out of the kitchen" means "close your mouth around Silicon Valley liberals" or you'll experience backlash. No, it means don't expect to be able to say controversial stuff without people who disagree with you also having their say.

I think the problem here is they are defining controversial as 'anything I don't agree with'.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#346

Post by seanmcdirmid » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:39 PM UTC

berberous wrote: post #333

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can understand why someone would vote for Romney, McCain, Bush, Dole, but for the life of me I assume that if you voted for Trump you were ok with everything that was known about him; e.g. you believe it is OK to talk about grabbing pussies in the locker room. Trump is special, never before have we had a candidate on either side like this, at least Bill Clinton appeared to be ashamed about his BJ in the whitehouse.…

How old are you? I remember people crying when Bush won in 2004. I remember some girl refusing to date a friend of mine because he voted for Bush. Bush received plenty of vilification, which if you are young, is easy to forget given the left now views him like an adorable goofy grandpa. The hate was intense at the time. (Although yes, it’s worse for Trump).

Old enough to remember Bush’s popularity sky rocketing after 9/11. Bush received plenty of vilification from the extreme left, but the moderate left were willing to go along with him as long as everything worked out (which is why he won in 2004). Bush was incredibly likable and didn’t come off as profane even to those that hated his politics.

The thing about Trump is that the moderate left and even many from the moderate right (my uncle never voted for a democrat until 2016) are mostly disgusted with the guy. It isn’t really about politics as it is about human decency against sexism, racism, and so on.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#347

Post by psyc » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:40 PM UTC

wz1000 wrote: post #99

sho wrote: post #46

What is crazy about the the situation in SF is that even 5 or so years ago if you asked me what the "echo chamber" there was echoing I would have said libertarianism and some kind of techno-utopianism. The takeover by the proscriptive far-left has been astonishingly rapid, and it is absolutely real. I also know people who have left, and many more who absolutely keep their political and even philosophical views to the…

> The takeover by the proscriptive far-left Americans have a very weird conception of what "far-left" means. Liberal feel good minority appeasement by billion dollar multinational corporations is as far from "far-left" as you can get.

It's very difficult to choose a single term to describe the cultural cluster that sho is referring to, that would not result in quibbling over the term, or whether it's a thing. I know which cultural cluster he's talking about. Closely related or alternate terms include social justice warrior, authoritarian left, regressive left, cultural marxist, identity politics, oppression stack, 3rd wave feminist, virtue-signaling left, neo-puritan, and so on. I've omitted a dozen other terms that are more like slurs, but I'm still a bit disappointed that most of these have some degree of negative connotation. I can't think of a totally neutral term that would be recognizable.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#348

Post by dang » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:40 PM UTC

refurb wrote: post #217

askafriend wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes it is. When you support Trump, you support his vile brand of leadership. The majority in this the country do not support this man or his ideas. They simply don't. The base that supported him and made this presidency possible is collapsing by all reported metrics (as in they are literally dying off, and younger people neither support Trump's ideas nor are they as religious). So while Trump's base may have squeezed…

Let me guess, you don't know any Trump supporters?

Please don't post unsubstantive swipes in discussions here.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#349

Post by ericd » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:40 PM UTC

mlloyd wrote: post #260

downandout wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment is a perfect example of the Valley's intense hatred of any remotely conservative viewpoint that the article is referring to. People have all kinds of reasons for voting for a particular candidate. It doesn't mean they endorse all of their actions or views. In this last election, I suspect that many Trump votes were made simply because they didn't like Hillary, and there were only two choices.

When you vote for a sexist and racist, don't be surprised when you're thought to be a sexist and racist. It's 2018, polite society has moved on from polite silence in the face of such backwards and discriminatory viewpoints. In a lot of circles anyway.

Or maybe those two things aren't everyone's top concerns, especially if they're struggling with the lower levels of Maslow's hierarchy, as many people in less prosperous parts of the country seem to be.

But even if you're well fed and feel secure in your future economic prospects, not caring very much about racism and sexism doesn't make you racist or sexist. It seems to me that most Republicans just don't care about those two things nearly as much as they care about other things. If you're surrounded by only white people, racism becomes a very abstract concept, vs if you live in a large multicultural city.

As a party, Democrats really need to start working on understanding the people who don't vote for them, rather than just assuming they're just insane bigots and insulting them as such in the process.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#350

Post by s73v3r_ » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:40 PM UTC

manfredo wrote: post #233

_skel wrote: post #169

I don't get it. I grew up in Silicon Valley and I work in tech, and so do many other people I know. They run the gamut from far-left socialists to libertarians to own a bunch of guns. They have all kinds of ethnic backgrounds and religious views. Some of my most libertarian/pro-gun friends have not been shy about their political views and it hasn't hurt their tech careers at all. They are far more welcome here than l…

I work in the Bay Area and I have personally worked with (as in, on the same team with and working directly in cooperation. CEOs, founders, etc. are not included in this count), exactly one person who discussed their conservative views. This is in comparison to hundreds of liberals. Sure, you may be able to identify at least one person on variety of ends of the political spectrum, but I don't think anyone can sanely…

When the topic of underrepresented groups comes up regarding women and minorities, the reason given a lot is that “they’re not interested” or something along those lines. Why would that not be the same reason here?