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If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#331

Post by x0x0 »

layer8 wrote: post #306
x0x0 wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since commits aren't code, that's no problem. The idea that because any piece of code could possibly contain some personal data -- while 99.99% of it doesn't -- that therefore the entirety is PD is not supported by the gdpr. You could as well say any text field anywhere can hypothetically have someone type their name and is thus personal data as well.

The current change applies to all input and output from and to Copilot. This can be used to create profiles about personal preferences, for example. Personal data is about identifying a person and relating information to that person. A name in an unrelated text field isn’t personal data if you can’t tell the relation between the name and the person who input it, or any surrounding data. The contents of a repository,…

> This can be used to create profiles about personal preferences

And since it's not, so what?

> I might be processing personal health data identifiable as such in a private repository with the help of Copilot.

That remains nonsense. The fact that you could put PD in a place not intended to hold PD does not magically transform entire datasets into PD because 1 record may contain it. This is covered in a24 (risk-based), and multiple edpb discussions of proportionate measures. There is zero requirement to guarantee anything collected for a different purpose is not misused by the user, assuming you're not encouraging that misuse.

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#332

Post by tempaccount420 »

roegerle wrote: post #283
forinti wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Poisoning LLMs is an interesting path of resistance.

Well known running code has more weight than unknown code that may not run. I think it’s pointless.

Unless the repository uses GitHub's CI. Then it's extremely useful, could be used as RL environment.

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#333

Post by Esophagus4 »

danaris wrote: post #326
Esophagus4 wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it needs to be opt-in. And again: Google did this and everyone eventually got over it. Cars do this with telematics data and everyone is over that too.

That doesn't change the ethics of it. The only reason that worked is because Google is an unstoppable monopoly juggernaut whose name is literally synonymous with searching the web.

Idk man… people have mostly decided they’re fine with sharing their data.

People use Google Maps even though their location is bought and sold openly. People put their deepest secrets into ChatGPT even after their CEO warned that they use it to sell you ads, keep all of it even after you delete it and may even be required to produce it during a lawsuit. People still buy new cars even though they track their movements.

What you feel is a deeply offensive ethical violation probably is fine with the general population. In general, people are willing to trade their data for good quality services.

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#334

Post by ares623 »

gverrilla wrote: post #120
ares623 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

make sure you opt-out anyway before deleting your account. they'll probably train on some archived version if it sees your profile didn't opt-out at some point.

honest question: is there any realistic mechanism that will make them accountable if let's say they just train on 100% of repos without regards to opt-ins? I operate under the premise these tech companies can do whatever they want and there's very little oversight.

No, there isn't. You're relying on PMs or engineers who still care will see it happening and call it out. Other than that, it can become evidence in some future lawsuit. But the damage to you would've already been don.

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#335

Post by danaris »

Esophagus4 wrote: post #333
danaris wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't change the ethics of it. The only reason that worked is because Google is an unstoppable monopoly juggernaut whose name is literally synonymous with searching the web.

Idk man… people have mostly decided they’re fine with sharing their data. People use Google Maps even though their location is bought and sold openly. People put their deepest secrets into ChatGPT even after their CEO warned that they use it to sell you ads, keep all of it even after you delete it and may even be required to produce it during a lawsuit. People still buy new cars even though they track their movements…

What you're describing is "revealed preferences theory", and it requires a truly free set of choices—essentially, when looking at it in relation to companies like Google, it relies on "free market theory", the kind that only works with a spherical market in a frictionless vacuum.

People "have decided" this because they're not given good choices, they're not well-informed about what their data is going to be used for, and their real buying power has been going down for decades so they don't have the disposable funds to put toward the much more expensive options that would allow them to retain their privacy (even in the rare cases where such options still exist).

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#336

Post by Mawr »

abustamam wrote: post #309
fragmede wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah it does. If you have to explain the joke, it makes it not funny. In the real world, people don't have explicit sarcasm markers, you have up deduce it. As a neurodivergent person, I reflexively downvote on /s because coddling people isn't going to help them grow or deal with the real world.

In the real world we have things like intonation, facial expressions, body language, and other indicators to denote sarcasm. On the internet it is very possible and often plausible that someone can very much believe what may appear to a reasonable person to be sarcasm. Having a crutch online does not equate to an equivalent crutch offline. Anecdotally, neurodivergent folks I know prefer, and some even require, a sarc…

There's even more to it — real conversations are interactive, so if a statement causes confusion, it can be cleared up immediately. Forum posts, however, must stand alone for the most part.

You probably also know the person you're talking to irl, so it's way easier to make the judgement call on whether they're serious or not, compared to a random person online.

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#337

Post by collinmanderson »

dotancohen wrote: post #157
lanxevo3 wrote: post #9

[flagged]

> takes 30 seconds. No, it takes an hour of perusing HN every day to stumble upon this. That's 20 hours per month, 240 hours per year, shall I bill it to GitHub or to Microsoft directly? Corrupting Steinmetz' quip to Ford: it's 30 seconds to flip the switch, 240 hours to know that a switch needs to be flipped.

I think they emailed everyone about this, but I might be wrong. Maybe they only emailed people who actually use copilot.

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#338

Post by pokot0 »

martinwoodward wrote: post #43

No we won’t. Details here https://github.blog/news-insights/company-news/updates-to-gi... For users of Free, Pro and Pro+ Copilot, if you don’t opt out then we will start collecting usage data of Copilot for use in model training. If you are a subscriber for Business or Pro we do not train on usage. The blog post covers more details but we do not train on private repo data at rest, just interaction data with Copilot.…

Question. How does it work if I own a repository (opt out, don't use copilot) and I give access to someone else (use is opted in and uses copilot). Do you train on his submissions of my code? How can you know what that he has the right to share the code with you for training?

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#339

Post by account42 »

Forgeties79 wrote: post #269
mememememememo wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I think you are right. Even a super ethical company can be taken over. There may be exceptions but it is more luck. I work for a SP500 that absolutely won't dont this and locks down prod access so a rogue staff can't do it. But if Larry or Zuck or Bezos buys them out, who knows.

I worry about a post-Gabe valve for this reason.

It's not like current Valve is a charity like some fans like to pretend. They already are a pretty predatory company.

Re: If you don't opt out by Apr 24 GitHub will train on your private repos

#340

Post by account42 »

chistev wrote: post #109
miohtama wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft would never do this (-:

I don't like when people make sarcastic remarks and sign off in a way that indicates it was sarcasm. It kills it for me. Lol. Like using that /s or using that smiling emoji sign you used. A good joke would land even if some other people miss it because of the text format. "Microsoft would never do this" would have landed for me.

You opinion on this matter means a lot to me and I will definitely take it into account for my future posts /s
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