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TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

bbc.com

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Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#331

Post by roughly »

roncesvalles wrote: post #202
khalic wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, saying that e2e encryption makes users _less_ safe is completely dishonest, nothing is fine about this. The logic of "anything is better than before" is also fallacious.

Depends on your definition of "safe". Imagine an adult DMs a nude photo to a minor (or other kinds of predation). If it's E2EE, no one except the sender and receiver know about this conversation. You want an MITM in this case to detect/block such things or at least keep record of what's going on for a subpoena. I agree that every messaging platform in the world shouldn't be MITM'd, but every messaging platform doesn'…

What was the rate of child exploitation in the GDR?

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#332

Post by roughly »

trashb wrote: post #215
philipallstar wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine Hamas are your government and want to figure out who's gay. You don't want a MITM in case they can do this. Pick your definition of safe.

In that case don't use Tiktok dm's to discuss your sexuality. I think it is strange that people feel like they have to be able to talk on sensitive topics over every interface they can get their hands on. Similarly in "traditional" media you may not want to discuss such private conversation on a radio broadcast. Perhaps you would rather discuss it on the phone or over snail mail as there is more of an expectation of…

Right, but it currently isn't a sensitive topic - homosexuality is, as of 2026, broadly legal in the United States. That's a relatively new state of affairs, historically speaking, and one which Afghanistan shared as recently as 2021.

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#333

Post by roughly »

gzread wrote: post #259
khalic wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Claiming e2e makes children less safe is flat out dishonest. And the irony of you criticising “absolutes” after trying to pass one is just delicious.

What are children at risk of, when E2EE is used? What are children at risk of, when E2EE is not used?

> What are children at risk of, when E2EE is used?

Potential exposure to abusive adults.

> What are children at risk of, when E2EE is not used?

State-sanctioned violence.

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#334

Post by smugglerFlynn »

Traster wrote: post #178

I think this is... fine? Am I just totally naive. I think it's fine to say "You don't really have privacy on this app" - as long as there are relatively good options of apps that do have privacy (and I think there are). TikTok is really a public by default type of social media, there's not much idea of mutual following or closed groups. So sure, you don't have privacy on tiktok, if you want it you can move to snapcha…

> as long as there are relatively good options of apps that do have privacy (and I think there are)

Once you have enormous network effect like TikTok has, you don't really have any free selection of alternative apps. You are free to use one, but you will be the only sad user over there.

Regulations are needed that would force large platforms like TikTok and Instagram to enable federation, opening them up to actual competition. This way platforms would be able to compete on monetisation and usability, instead of competing on locking in their precious users more strictly.

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#335

Post by MetaWhirledPeas »

"makes users less safe"

They don't believe that. It makes it more difficult to deal with governments, is all. Big Brother needs your messages from time to time, and TikTok is not willing to risk getting shut down to argue against that. We can't have pesky principles getting in the way of money.

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#336

Post by Cider9986 »

trashb wrote: post #223
computerex wrote: post #37

TikTok is a front for government surveillance, so it's not really surprising that this is their position.

The government are able to access your conversations, data and connections with e2ee in place already. I don't see how not having e2ee would have an effect on that ability in any way.

Please provide proof for these claims.

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#337

Post by lucasfin000 »

I dont think the argument is really about child safety. If it was tiktok would also be working on fixing their algorithm that can send minors toward harmful content, which is a far larger documented vector than encrypted DMs. This is about preserving access.

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#338

Post by max-privatevoid »

throwaway290 wrote: post #244
RobotToaster wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tiktok has direct messages, they don't even call them private. It's better that they're honest about this, nobody should believe for a second that WhatsApp or FB messages are truly E2EE. DM on social media shouldn't be used for anything remotely private. It's a convenience feature, nothing more.

> nobody should believe for a second that WhatsApp or FB messages are truly E2EE That's interesting. You think all firms that audited WhatsApp and Signal protocol used by WhatsApp and all programmers who worked there for decades and can see a lie and leak if it was true are all crooks? valid opinion I guess, but I won't call it "no one should believe for a second (curious you didn't mention Telegram, it is actually m…

I'll believe it when it's FOSS

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#339

Post by Razengan »

debazel wrote: post #39
xeckr wrote: post #22

Brilliant. They're repackaging the argument governments have long made about E2EE being dangerous to children.

Children are just too effect of a tool when building a surveillance state. We should have banned children from owning open computers a long time ago just like we do with Alcohol, Driving licenses, etc. Instead children would own special devices that are locked down and tagged with a "underage" flag when interacting with online services, while adults could continue as normal. We already heavily restrict the freedom of…

> while adults could continue as normal.

After providing their identities to prove they are adults, and having all their activities tracked wherever they go and whatever they do.

The first 18 years aren't freedom either, just the system prepping you for what's ahead.

Re: TikTok will not introduce end-to-end encryption, saying it makes users less safe

#340

Post by quotemstr »

It's one thing to make a policy decision I disagree with. It's another to lie, blatantly, to my face about it. But what do you expect from people who bought TikTok specifically so they could add censorship and lied about it being some kind of national security issue?
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